SPEAKER_00: 2:20

So 305 work and 45 steps. It's re trained to added qualifications that can be tricked by added skills to its toolkits. And now he works with 24 second workplaces all over Australia, helping people to look after their bodies, their brains, and their strategies while they're on crazy, crazy roster test. So if you are a shift worker or your loved ones, I'd love to hear from you this morning. What's the hardest part of your roster and what has it actually helped you to cut? So we're looking for tips and fixes 103882 or tips. 0487 619882. Roger, hello.

SPEAKER_01: 3:05

How are you, Christy? Thank you so much for having me.

SPEAKER_00: 3:08

This is great. I thought this is a really good conversation. I was just talking with uh one of our colleagues over on the other side of the country, and she said this is a great conversation. I thought, well, let's have it here in WA because we have such a big uh shift working roster, especially with all of our resources personnel. So for those of us who haven't had to work shift, what's the hardest part of a roster that has you up when you should be asleep?

SPEAKER_01: 3:34

I I think without any doubt whatsoever, one of the most difficult things about shift work is literally just being a shift worker. And I think we underestimate the fact that being separated from just normal everyday nine to five life has massive disadvantages on us in socially and our mental health and things like that as well. Also, I would imagine uh like night shift, being awake when everyone else is trying to sleep, trying to sleep when the neighbour's enjoying servicing his car next door. I'm sure anyone that's a night shift worker will relate to that. Or that's the time when we're trying to sleep when they always want to whip a snip or mow the lawn next door as well, don't they? But it's a massive problem. But you know, your partner's out socializing with friends, and you're the one that's missing out all the time. It's very difficult.

SPEAKER_00: 4:21

Yeah. So you coach other shift workers now. So what are the biggest mistakes that you see people making that quietly wreck their sleep and their health?

SPEAKER_01: 4:30

Yeah, I do. Um I I I've been coaching shift workers now for the last six years after doing 40 years of shift work myself. And one of the two main areas that I start with clients, which I find really helps them enormously. And one of the first things that we have to do is we have to remember that we're human and we are diurnal, which means we are we should be sleeping at night and we are awake during the day. So even though that we're awake, we have to remember that our system is sleeping and does not metabolize or store nutrients the same overnight as it does during the day. So what we need to keep in mind with this is eating overnight when our body is resting causes biological chaos to our system. So we need to keep our food intake to a biological day, which is basically when it's light, when the sun is up, um, and eating at a regular breakfast, lunch, dinner times, things like that. And I highly recommend to clients, and I know I get opposition to this, but I highly recommend to clients that they fast from 9 p.m. until 6 a.m. And if you need to eat, and obviously, you know, you've got very busy miners and people working in um resources like that in the um in the Western Australia there, um, and they do need to eat, you can't go all night without anything, but you know, we've got to try and avoid those highly palatable carbohydrates and fats. You know, we've got to keep away from the vending machine. I suggest that we fast, but if we need to eat, we just have light protein snacks. And when I say light protein snacks, like things like a protein shake or um taking, you know, grabbing a handful of fruit or taking a handful of nuts and just having those overnight instead of having all those other things. Secondly, we've got to understand that we can't catch up on sleep, and this is one of the biggest problems that a lot of our FIFO um people have as well. We get to a day off and then we think, oh, I'm just gonna sleep in, or we get to days off and we're sleep schedules all over the place. Catching up on sleep or having that sleeping literally creates like biological chaos in our body, and what it does is it phase shifts our circadian rhythm even further out of sync. So while we might get that instant gratification, what does actually happen is, and people will notice this, you tend to crash not long afterwards and you feel really ordinary in the afternoon. And that is because your circadian rhythm has no idea where it's at in time and spot.

SPEAKER_00: 7:03

Yeah, let's talk about non-negotiables from you for staying sane and reasonably healthy on a roster like that.

SPEAKER_01: 7:11

Yep, yeah. I I think my absolute non-negotiables, there's a there's three or four, there's four actually that are non-negotiables. Number one, if every shift worker remembered that their meal timers need to be at normal day walker time. So try and eat breakfast at breakfast time, lunch at lunch time, uh, dinner at dinner time, and not outside of that, people really do come good because our body is primed to metabolise and store nutrients at that time. The other, the next step is to get your light diet right. And I speak about the light diet all the time. Everyone's looking for a diet, but the light diet is without doubt the absolute best. That means getting early daylight and as much daylight during the day as possible. Keeping in mind we're a human, so we need that daylight. High hydration for a ship worker, our system is really struggling because we're eating and we're uh, you know, we're all irregular, we're asleep when we should be awake, we're awake when we should be asleep. But keeping high hydration and keeping our system flushed and running all the time keeps us running really, really well. And when we do sleep, and this is where a lot of our uh West Australian FIFO have trouble, it needs to be dark, it needs to be quiet, and it needs to be cool. And a simple rule of thumb: if you hold your arm out at your arm's length in front of your face and turn your hand to face you, if you can see your hand, it's too light. And we need to be wearing either a sleep mask or using blockout blinds for things like that. So they're my if you get those right, everyone thrives.

SPEAKER_00: 8:51

That's brilliant. Uh you you you touched briefly on nutrition um and when to eat. So what does a good 24 hours of eating actually look like compared to a bad one? Is it is it purely trying to to to make sure you sort of fast between nine and six and uh reduce the carbs?

SPEAKER_01: 9:09

Yep. Yeah, best thing to do is uh remember breakfast like a king, so we want high protein carbs and fats, so we have breakfast like a king. We had lunch like a princess with protein and fiber. Remember, protein and fibre is what keeps us full for longer. Dinner like a paupa, so as we get later in the day, so we lighten our food up. This is where we as humans get it wrong in society today, and we want protein and lower GI carbs. So we want like our whole grains, our quinoa, brown rice, whole grain pasta, you know, our whole grain sourdough breads, beans, and lentils. And then overnight, once it gets dark, we go into that period of fasting overnight with high hydration. I think that's one that really helps. And a bad day would obviously be just not eating enough during the day and then hitting the vending machines for those quick fixes. Anyone that works nights know that we really struggle with lack of energy, and our body craves highly palatable carbohydrates and fats for energy. So the vending machine is the most attractive person in the room without any doubt whatsoever, and that's why we're drawn to it.

SPEAKER_00: 10:19

Yeah. So chief work doesn't just hit our body, does it? It hits relationships as well, especially when one partner is on nights or fly-fly and FIFA and the rest of the family isn't. What have you seen really help couples and families navigate that?

SPEAKER_01: 10:34

Yeah, great. This is a fantastic question. And and particularly for your listeners there in WA with the fly-in-fly out. I think the the good thing about people in fly in, fly out is they've got time between the time they leave work and before they hit home. And I do honestly believe that all shift workers need to put solid boundaries between work and home. Take the time to decompress from both so that you're not taking home to work and you're not bringing home back. And I think the people that are keeping the home fires burning back at home while our people are out at work, I think the best thing that they can do is give our shift workers a bit of space when they first come home to re-acclimatize back into that family unit. And the second most important thing, um, Christina, I think, is schedule family time. Just like you've got a roster, roster in some family time and some partner time to reconnect. Make it really important and a really important part of your schedule. Everyone knows their roster. Once you know it, schedule that time in. Make date night, reconnect. Schedule time in to go to the local, you know, restaurant and sit and have a conversation and and do those things. Just reconnect instead of there just being blurred lines between both.

SPEAKER_00: 11:50

And last one for you, Roger, before I let you go. For anyone who's listening right now, they feel cooked, exhausted, grumpy, thinking, I can't keep doing this. What's one small change they could make that would give them a really big payoff now?

SPEAKER_01: 12:04

The biggest payout payoff is to get daylight during the day. Now I know people are going to say to me, Oh, but what about night shift? Even when you're on night shift, sleep, then get up and get daylight. Our human body demands it. So if you get your light diet right by making sure that your body is anchored to a particular time every day, it does help us biologically. So all those hormones are released the right way. We metabolize and store food the right way, it improves our mental health, it keeps our body ticking along in a very big way. And then we need to block light at night or blue light at night by wearing like blue light blocking glasses, or to just have circadian-friendly lighting. And start there, massive changes makes massive changes just by small things and getting that bit right.

SPEAKER_00: 12:56

Roger Aston, great advice. Thank you so much for taking the time to have a chat with us and our listeners today.

SPEAKER_01: 13:01

Thank you very much for having me.

SPEAKER_00: 13:03

Cheers, Roger Sutherland, certified uh nutritionist and former police officer who's taken his years of experience working shift work to start up a great little business. It's called A Healthy Shift. So you can log on and have a look at what he's doing. Connect with him on LinkedIn if you'd like and uh ask him some questions yourself. But really important to look after yourself. And I know a lot of you have had a really nice break that you're about to launch back in the workspace to tell you it will be shift work and it is hard and we do appreciate the work that you're doing.