Shift Worker Transition and Lifestyle Tips

Speaker 1 0:16

So , cool , those Commodores , weren't they ? Just as cool as that . Speaking of cool Benny Boy is the first voice you'll hear when you ring through working the other side of the glass . Come and join us up , Roger , hello , Hello .

Speaker 4 0:39

How are you this morning ?

Speaker 1 0:42

I could be a bit younger and I could have just a little bit more hair . Or a ravioli in front of you , a ravioli in front of me . We broke bread last Friday night . It was fantastic and thank you for your company . It was wonderful to do that A little place down and interesting . I mentioned to our great friend Gerald Quigley oh , did you ? I said we broke bread on Friday night , friday night In Hampton , and he said where did you go ? And I told him he said well , you could have called oh dear , because he's not that far away . So he was a bit cross that we were there .

Speaker 4 1:18

Can we name it ? It was a fantastic place .

Speaker 1 1:20

You can .

Speaker 4 1:20

Il Forno , il Forno , il Forno , down in Hampton Boy . It was Il Forno , il Forno , il Forno , down in Hampton Boy . It was just the best food . I know someone who fell in love with a particular bottle of wine down there too .

Speaker 1 1:33

Well , and only because the boss man came over and they'd been in business for a long time about 30-plus years , I think . He said he'd been there and he said it's the toughest he's ever known , which most businesses will say the toughest they've ever known . Put that aside for one moment . He then made a recommendation , a cheeky little thing from the Brosser , which was branded 2015, . So it's got a bit of age on it and I think he charged about $45 for that bottle .

Speaker 4 2:02

Yep , I remember you asking the prop . Omg , he said to you what do you reckon it's worth ? And we both well , we were sitting together .

Speaker 1 2:12

We both looked at it and we looked at the label After tasting it and I said I think I said it's somewhere between 80 and 90 , maybe Yep 80 and $100 wine 45 ?

Speaker 4 2:22

45 bucks . That's Jewish Amazing . It's a top restaurant . Really highly recommend it to anybody that's down that way , or Forno in Hampton .

Speaker 1 2:30

There's a plug , but it was great it was interesting because we also talked good morning to all the shift workers as well . For those that are up late and often don't sleep , which is really the great core audience of the Australia Overnight Program , it's nice to know you're there . We'd love you to come and join us for a yak . 133693 . We've got lots of things we want to discuss with you . 133693 , for the shift workers in particular . It was interesting because you and I then spoke about the idea of the shift worker or going out on the Friday night , that is , after you've worked until 5.30 or 6 on the Friday morning . So during that day you're trying to readjust to some sense of normality , heading into , let's call it , the weekend . Yeah .

Speaker 1 3:16

And yet hanging around to have a bite to eat with dear friends like yourself and others , come 6.30 or 7 , I'm thinking we should have probably done lunch .

Speaker 4 3:25

It was a tactical , really , really bad mistake for us , like a really bad mistake , and we talked about it at the table because I think when you're coming out of nights , as you do on the Friday , so you've done your five nights , you've done Sunday to Friday morning , get home , have a sleep . You need to be forced to get up , to go out , to get yourself up and out and get yourself into a routine . And we should have gone and done lunch and forced you to lunch and we would have all been married asleep .

Speaker 1 3:59

That's right . Well , that's right . Yes , but also we could have been watching footy . Well , that was discussed too , wasn't it the Friday night ?

Speaker 4 4:06

game . You would have been nodding off on the couch , but anyway .

Speaker 1 4:09

Which is a lovely thing to do , and then you get ready for the next day to actually then get into doing a bit of exercise and walking or gardening or whatever you're going to do across the weekend .

Speaker 4 4:17

Exactly right . But the key point here is to get up and get yourself out when you're coming out of night shift , because the potential is that you actually just lounge around , which you probably ended up doing , which is why you would have struggled to get up and get going to go to dinner , like you're hanging around , hanging around waiting , and yet , had you have got up and gone to lunch , that box would have been ticked and then you would have been back home ready to go to bed at the right time At the right time , instead of kicking on to what I thought at the time was probably a bit too late .

Speaker 4 4:50

I thought it was about nine o'clock , but it wasn't .

Speaker 1 4:54

This is not about us , by the way , but I think it shares the idea of thousands of people who actually go through that idea of transitioning from day into night . For example , a great friend of this program is Christian . Now , christian , as you may or may not know , is a driver and has gone back off driving pretty much and doing a lot more office work but for a long time remains a bit of a shift worker in many , many ways Christian . It's not easy to sort of navigate , is it ?

Speaker 3 5:20

No , Good morning boys . How are we ?

Speaker 1 5:21

We're well . You wanted to say .

Speaker 3 5:24

Okay , so I've now come off the road . I'm more in the office now on a permanent basis and have now started at 1pm in the afternoon and usually finish about 1am 1.30 in the morning . So I'm actually finding it harder now to get out of bed .

Speaker 4 5:43

Oh , that's interesting . So you're finishing at 1.30 . How long does it take you to get home , Christian ?

Speaker 3 5:49

Roughly 45 minutes . I live in Geelong .

Speaker 4 5:52

Oh right , so you would be not getting to bed until about 2.30 am , would that be fair ?

Speaker 3 5:57

Yeah , something like that . I have something small to eat , watch a bit of TV for maybe 15 minutes .

Speaker 4 6:03

No , no , tv , no TV . No TV Christian , that's a killer , don't get me wrong here . I know you want to relax , but it's our potential . Sorry , our tendency is to go straight for our phone or straight for the TV to relax . That blue light from that TV is causing you heaps of problems .

Speaker 3 6:21

Right . So , Even 15 minutes .

Speaker 4 6:28

That bright light is enough to really disrupt your circadian rhythm . You've got to remember you've been up exposed to light because you're working in an office , now right , so you're under that blue light in the evening when that melatonin is supposed to come on about 8 , 39 oclock . It can't come in because you're being exposed to that blue light through the LED lights or fluorescent lights in your office . I want to talk about light a bit later on tonight , but the thing is with light . And then you come home , look at your phone , you know , scroll on your phone , look at the TV . That is all blue light which is severely impacting your circadian rhythm . So to relax , here's one for you . Find yourself a boring magazine under a dull light .

Speaker 3 7:12

Right Boring magazine .

Speaker 4 7:14

A boring magazine , something that doesn't stimulate you .

Speaker 1 7:17

Where do you find a magazine these days ? Online , maybe . So the other thing is , what about a podcast ? I mean , you could listen to a podcast or , more importantly , christian , as you do , listen to Paddy on the overnight program . Well , that's true , or me , for that example .

Speaker 3 7:34

Well , I've got to be careful because I've got a good lady wife at home , so I can't wake her up either .

Speaker 1 7:40

Headphones Olsen .

Speaker 3 7:42

Yeah , no , she's got good ears . Most women , do you up Headphones ? Olsen ?

Speaker 1 7:45

Yeah , no , she's got good ears . Most women do you know how it is Even when you're wearing earphones , they can hear everything .

Speaker 3 7:50

They know what you're thinking , even when you're asleep . Yeah , that's true . Well , that's a different conversation . Christian for a different program .

Speaker 1 7:58

We'll talk to you when Gabrielle Morrissey is here talking about sexology .

Speaker 3 8:02

Right .

Speaker 4 8:58

Sounds good to me . Well , you said your wife knows what you're thinking . That's right .

Speaker 1 9:01

Good on you , Christian . Thank you Podcast , because you're a great fan of the podcast or listening to something by way of dozing .

Speaker 4 9:09

I love it .

Speaker 4 9:11

Now I run my own podcast as well , which we haven't really discussed on the show at all and you were taken quite by surprise about my podcast that I've got and if people on any platform it's on Apple , it's on Google Podcasts , it's on Spotify and it's called A Healthy Shift , obviously , If people put shift work in , I think it's the only one that comes up , which is fantastic for me . But I run a few episodes a week , which are Expresso episodes , talking about 12 minutes . I've tried to do it for 12 to 20 minutes for people on their commute going to work or coming back , so they can get an episode in . Then every fortnight I put out an interview that I've done with someone that's a subject matter expert in our field that is going to help us with some sort of tactical strategy , whether it's light exposure , managing stress , managing compassion , fatigue .

Speaker 4 10:04

I've had a whole range of fantastic guests on the podcast that everyone just agrees to come on and talk about the shift work side of things . So it's been really good . But audio books are the go now . Audio books are really the go . Oh , I love my audio books .

Impact of Blue Light on Health

Speaker 1 10:19

I actually heard one as I was doing a little bit of stuff yesterday , talking about the founder of the Grout Guy . You know the Grout Guy , the great jingle , the great advertiser on 3OW and how that was set up , and I found that intriguing because you get these insights into those wonderful businesses . We will do this . Come back and join us . 133693 . Roger Sutherland , it's a healthy shift . Podcasting your calls For those that work shift work . We're going to hear from you . 133693 . Good morning to you . I'm T-Mac . Roger Sutherland is here . A healthy shift . Veteran law enforcement officer is our .

Speaker 1 10:58

Roger works with the great people and workers in particular to thrive , not just survive , those great shift workers . Instagram , you can do that . A underscore healthy , underscore shift have a look at that . The website ahealthyshiftcom . I think we've got everything covered . We're just talking about podcasts on this program and this program is podcasts and we just checked with Benny . A lot of people get it the next day and listen to it on Catch Up , as they do on the 3AW app , for example , and then inside the 3AW app there's wonderful things . Neil Mitchell did an amazing interview . Well , it was a chat . Really , it wasn't an interview . I hate that word interview . It was a great chat with David Koch .

Speaker 4 11:40

Okay , you should have a listen to it . It's fantastic .

Speaker 1 11:44

We talked about Koshy and how he moved into Seven out of his area and what he's been doing and what the challenges of getting up and doing Brekkie , for example , for years and how he became , the sensation that he became and then moving into things like the Port Adelaide Footy Club of which he's the president and all that sort of stuff . So it's worthwhile having a look at , particularly for people I would imagine listening through 5AA . If you want to have a look at it , it's on the 3AW app and you'll find it there . Have a listen to Neil Mitchell talking to your great David Koch .

Speaker 4 12:16

It's a wonderful spot . Yeah , and on the app , it is fantastic the 3OW app as well because as you go through it , every single show is edited without the ads , without the news in it or anything like that , and it literally is just from ad break to ad break and if you need it , you can put it on two-time speed as well and just listen to it . It's a little bit quicker but you get it . But those interviews that are grabbed , that are done and just put up there , you can just listen to those as well . They're just absolutely fantastic .

Speaker 1 12:46

It's the way of doing things these days . You make the point should we sleep with the light on ? Should we sleep with the light on , or why we should not sleep with the light on .

Speaker 4 12:55

I was listening to a podcast the other day from a Dr Martin Moore-Ede . Now , dr Martin Moore-Ede is actually the researcher that discovered the biological clock in the human brain , so he's been around a long time . Not that we've known about it we knew about it in animals but he was saying that 50% of the elderly population sleep with the light on . 50% of them sleep with the light on , and sleeping with the light on puts people into a pre-diabetic state . It puts them into a pre-diabetic state because of the disruption to the circadian rhythm , because we have these cells that are detecting light , and by putting people into this pre-diabetic state . So what they've done in their research laboratory that they've got in Boston is they've put a group of people into sleeping quarters without lights on and with lights on , and they've monitored all their blood glucose levels and sugars . A varying age group yeah , yeah , varying ages . And also what they do is they have identified that just by having the lid on , it is actually increasing their pre-diabetic state .

Speaker 4 14:08

Now you've got to remember pre-diabetes is not a good place to be right , because you are literally just a smidgen from becoming diabetic as well , and once you cross the Jordan into being diabetic , there's no , oh , I've made a mistake . I'll come back again . And this is the impact , tony , that light is having on us . And blue light , not just light , but blue light . By trying to save money in lights , by trying to save money by making these energy efficient lights laced with blue light , working in these overnight environments like hospitals , the impact of light is phenomenal on our biological system .

Speaker 1 14:46

So for those that are tuning in and watching this online now , for example , I spend probably a little bit too much time going around and turning lights off .

Speaker 4 14:55

I love it On night shift . Yeah Well , I talked to you before about this , not off , but turn them down .

Speaker 1 14:59

Night shift . Yeah , yeah , well , I told you before about this . Not off , but turn them down .

Speaker 4 15:00

Yeah , but that's good though , because the lower they are , the less blue light there actually is in them . But even you know , like these lights that we've got above us now , they're probably pretty good . There'd be a bit of blue light , but not a great deal . But I wouldn't want to be like Ben sitting in there , or even with those fluorescent lights there . It is literally light pollution now .

Speaker 4 15:21

And Dr Martin Moreed was talking to us , was saying on the podcast this , what I was listening to today Fix those lights . Yeah , that's the end of those , just turn them off . Well , I was looking in that direction as well , but anyway , a bit glary . He was actually talking about a hospital and this is the impact of light . Um , in a hospital that in a psych ward they have patients coming into a psych ward and the people that were on the side that the sun comes up and gets all the sun light the early sunlight compared to the patients that were on the other side of the wing , that were getting the late sunlight , the ones on the early side were in and out in half the time than the people that were on the other side . And this is the early light . This is why we talk about the people who are up so late .

Speaker 4 16:08

Listen to radio , listen to podcasts . Watching television , in particular , because people will listen to the radio , but watching TV ? Listen to the radio , fantastic , if you can't sleep , but watching a TV with that blue light hitting your eye is really causing major problems . And in fact he says and you're ready for this ?

Speaker 1 16:28

he's a controversy .

Speaker 4 16:30

light will be the new asbestos .

Speaker 1 16:33

Mark my words Light that you and I know and love .

Speaker 4 16:37

It'll be the new asbestos .

Speaker 1 16:38

Why is it now ? Why hasn't it been for 100 years where we've had light ?

Speaker 4 16:42

No , because we are now going for the energy efficient LED lights which are laced with blue light .

Speaker 4 16:49

They have a massive blue light spike which is between 460 and 495 nanometers of light , and that's the blue spike . Now , even though we can't see it , because it's white , because it's all mixed together and burning , I've done a podcast with Dr Martin Morey . It's well and truly worth a listen . It will terrify you . It will terrify you . I sat there at the end of the podcast going . I'm actually going to go around my house because we've got LED lights in our roof . Well , we all have , and we were encouraged to do that . Well , we work for energy efficiency , but you're going to find that we are going to lighting in the future . Mark my words on record today , while we sit here , lighting will come with a cancel warning on it . Mark my words it will come with a cancel warning on it . Mark my words it will come with a cancer warning on it in years to come . And light manufacturers are well and truly aware of the damage that their lights are doing . Yeah , well and truly aware .

Speaker 1 17:43

And so not so much in this studio but in other studios in this building we are surrounded by screens these days doing what we're doing surrounded by screens when I say that , there's two in front of you , there's three , four , five in front of you , there's three , four , five in front of me , including ones sitting up on the walls there . So at some point , all that blue light , yeah , blue light .

Speaker 4 18:02

And are we not questioning why cancer has increased in society today ?

Speaker 1 18:07

Well , I guess we have .

Speaker 4 18:08

Well , we do question it , we're aware of it , we do question it , but we do question it . But I mean there's been like 10,000 research papers .

Speaker 1 18:13

How do we ?

Speaker 4 18:13

turn that ship around . Well , it's quite easy , actually , because there's companies now that are manufacturing what they call circadian lighting , right , and it's not going out and buying blue light glasses , right ? That's not what we're talking about here . We're talking about circadian lighting , and they're putting circadian lighting into what was the name of it . There's a big group of companies that are top on the stock exchange , not important to the story , but go on , yep , but they're putting this circadian lighting in . I'll tell you something now . If the blue light spectrum is taken out of the light in your workplace while you work at night and the blue light spectrum is , your brain doesn't even know you're awake , all right . It's not even aware that you're awake because it's not getting the blue light on the melanopsin .

Speaker 1 19:04

There's a lot happening in there , so the answer to the question is why should you sleep with the light not on you ?

Speaker 4 19:10

shouldn't sleep because it's disrupting your circadian rhythm and it's causing you biological damage .

Speaker 1 19:14

There's a lot happening . We'll take your calls the other side . 1-double-3-6-9-3 . Roger's here . I'm Tony McManus . It is the night shift for those . A healthy night shift . If you like , come and join us . A healthy shift for those shift workers . 1-double-3-6-9-3 . I'm Tony McManus . Roger Sutherland is here . We're talking all things to do with shift work . 133693 . If you'd like to jump on board , I think people are listening and not so much inclined to call on this particular Thursday morning . Can you please ask your guest , which is Roger , the name of podcast to which he was referring ? What's it called ?

Speaker 4 19:52

The podcast , my podcast , I'm assuming it's A . Healthy Shift , a Healthy Shift , and I'll have to look up what episode it is , but it's the episode that's got Dr Martin Moore . That's the one , yeah .

Speaker 1 20:03

It's well worth listening to . All right , so you find that . Now , where do you find that podcast On all ?

Speaker 4 20:08

platforms .

Speaker 1 20:08

You can find it on Apple Podcasts and it's called A Healthy Shift A Healthy Shift and find the good doctor on the program which we've done . Very interesting interview , tommy . Thank you for that nice feedback . So tell us about the courses that you're running or you're planning to run . What do we need to know about that as we do this through together ?

Speaker 4 20:30

Right . We're in a real problem area at the moment as far as shift work goes . In our shift working communities . Our frontline health and also first responders are completely burnt out . They're in a really bad way as far as they're understaffed , they're getting overworked and the public are just really putting a lot of pressure on them all around .

Speaker 1 20:51

Well , can I just because I'd love some interviews , I'd love some callers about this , that assertion that you make ? I'd like that confirmed . Yep , I'd like to find out from shift workers or those that have done shift work did you get to the stage where it was overwhelming ? Is that ?

Speaker 4 21:08

what you're asserting . Oh absolutely Burnt out and stressed and no name , no pack drill . I know a lot of people won't call because they don't want to be identified .

Speaker 1 21:15

That's the issue , I guess , but we're happy you don't ?

Speaker 4 21:17

Honestly , you do not have to give your name , but call us up and tell us what's going on in your workplace , because I know the nurses are in a real bad way at the moment , like a really , really bad way .

Speaker 4 21:29

When you say bad way . What does that mean ? Totally understaffed , doing double shifts ? Um , don't feel like their management is supporting them in any way . I coach a lot of nurses , a lot of my I can speak on from authority because I coach a lot that are really struggling doing double shifts , um , really getting burnt out . There's a lot of abuse from the public towards the nurses . I can't understand why , but there is . Who would abuse nurses ? Oh , a lot of people . They get abused all the time , especially in emergency departments from drug-affected or alcohol-affected people as well that I'm getting seen .

Speaker 1 22:06

So they're people that are already damaged arriving into a situation .

Speaker 4 22:10

Yeah , in a way , yeah , yeah , but someone's got to staff those areas From their own choice . Yes , yep , yeah , yeah , yeah , that's right . So we're in a position where they're very highly stressed , they're really , really suffering from being overworked and there's no education at all . In shift working environments , like when people are inducted , they might get a flyer or a 15-minute lecture or make sure you eat the right things and exercise . So what I'm doing is I'm actually running health and wellbeing seminars and I'm travelling the country at the moment for agencies that want me to actually go into these areas and I run a two-hour seminar that actually improves morale in the workplace , it reduces unplanned leave and it actually increases productivity in the area , because people then learn how to go about doing shift work , which they haven't done before , and they're making huge mistakes . Shift workers are the worst self-sabotagers because there's no education .

Speaker 1 23:16

And I'm here to change it , and full credit to

Shift Workers and Salt Lamps

Speaker 1 23:19

you . But the point of that is , I guess , is why aren't the top-level people associated with that ? Why aren't they driving those sorts of information available to shift workers ?

Speaker 4 23:30

I don't think they know that it's available which is what .

Speaker 4 23:32

I'm . I mean that's probably pretty shallow , because if they're having trouble keeping staff and unplanned leave is through the roof which it is in all agencies unplanned leave is absolutely through the roof everywhere at the moment . The problem is , but they're not educating their staff as to how to go about even rostering , how to roster people in a forward rotation instead of a backward rotation , and even we talked about it the lighting that are in these 24-7 workplaces , call centres and places like that . We have to really start stripping down , and I mean stripping down our 24-7 work environments and rebuilding them as shift work environments with breaks , lenny in Melton morning .

Speaker 5 24:16

Good morning guys . Look , I work at Tellemarine Airport as a highly driver , catering for TA Australia and Qantas for 26 years . I loved it yeah , absolutely loved it , and so we've had that conversation .

Speaker 1 24:35

I think , yeah , absolutely loved it , and so we've had that conversation , I think in the past , lenny , so you survived it . You enjoyed that work and that overnight work .

Speaker 5 24:44

I can't say the point because at the end of the day , the job's got to be done and the big trick with working shift work is it's great if you've got great people around you . Agreed , yeah , good point If you haven't got great people around you , and we had magnificent people there .

Speaker 1 25:04

I don't think that's in dispute , though really is it no , we've always got great people around us about how that whole team is managed for the well-being of themselves . The other side of retirement , I guess too , totally , absolutely , tony .

Speaker 4 25:17

well-being of themselves , the other side of retirement , I guess too , totally , totally , absolutely tony . This is the thing if everyone's on the same page in your workplace . This is why I run these seminars in the workplace to get everyone that all you got to do is do this and everyone then starts to generate , because you know the the fish rots at the head and we've got to be in a position where we've got to educate people and get people in their work environments all on the same page of the best way to go about it , and then everyone supports each other , and that's what we're trying to aim to get to , doris , good morning .

Speaker 6 25:46

Good morning , Tony and Roger , Salt lamps . They would actually be best for shift workers , wouldn't they ?

Speaker 4 25:53

Agreed Because they've got hash on the brain . Absolutely would actually be best for shift workers , wouldn't ?

Speaker 4 25:55

they Agreed Because they've got house on the brain , absolutely . So what sort of lamps , doris ? A salt lamp , an orange . You know the orange salt lamp , tony . They're like an orange lamp , they're a salt rock . They're excellent , doris . I use one of those , my partner and I use one in the lounge room at night and we just have that on , so it just casts an orange glow over the room . I actually put a photo of it on my Insta story the other day about what we do with our lighting , because I've got one of those bulbs that you can adjust the lighting in as well and I change it to red or an orangey red that matches the salt lamp . So our room just has this orange glow . I've got to tell you , when you're sitting there reading or whatever , and you've got the orange lights on , it's amazing how tired you get a lot quicker than if you're sitting there watching TV .

Speaker 1 26:41

So I've got no idea what you're talking about when you talk about a salt lamp .

Speaker 4 26:45

Yeah , it's called a salt lamp .

Speaker 1 26:47

S-A-L-T .

Speaker 4 26:48

S-A-L-T salt lamp , and it actually sweats .

Speaker 6 26:55

Doris , do you have one ? Yeah , oh yeah . Yeah , I've got one , and it's actually made of salt , so you do have to switch it on so that it doesn't actually disintegrate . But that's why they say even looking at a fire is good , because it's the red . It emits red , not blue .

Speaker 4 27:04

Yep , you're absolutely spot on .

Speaker 1 27:07

Really , when do you get these salt lamps , Doris oh , Kmart you can get them anywhere A health . I don't know health shops .

Speaker 4 27:20

Kmart , Meyer , anywhere . You can get a salt lamp just about anywhere .

Speaker 1 27:24

Why am I only hearing about this for the first time ? Roger , we're going to have to show you what a salt lamp is .

Speaker 4 27:29

Salt lamps are actually excellent and it's because of the light and Doris is absolutely on the money here it's because of the orange and red glow . You notice that when you go camping we've talked about this before that you can sit there and you're singing , you know you've got your guitar and you're singing Kumbaya around the fire and it's orange light . There's no blue light in it at all .

Speaker 1 27:50

We'd sing there's a light across the valley , there's a light under the sea , but a brighter light is shining inside me , babe , inside you or whatever . The song is Great lyric . Doris , thank you for that great call .

Speaker 4 28:02

It's interesting Salt lamp they're very , very heavy , like very heavy . It's a piece of salt and it is . It's got a globe inside it and they actually I don't know , do they absorb the moisture out of the room ?

Speaker 1 28:17

I think they absorb the moisture out of the room as well , how much money Not even expensive at all 31 bucks 31 , 32 .

Speaker 1 28:27

Heavy , Thank you , he ain't heavy . Constantly in trouble , says Matthew . Good morning Matthew , not his real name . Constantly in trouble with management . The subject bad discussions among colleagues for doing my early mornings and nights in minimal office light . They all say you must have lights on and think it's because you are sleeping and nothing more . They all do shift work and sit in fully lit offices all day and night . Something needs to change in awareness in these excessive light environments it's torture and then just creates a massive stressful environment . That's from Matthew . Great text , matthew .

Speaker 4 29:03

I'm going to buy you a beer for that one , because I'll tell you , Matthew , you will be the person who is full of life and health and they will all be suffering with diabetes and they will have massive problems down the track .

Speaker 1 29:18

I mean we've got to be careful about that ?

Speaker 4 29:19

Well , I do , but they will be suffering .

Speaker 1 29:21

Well , we've got to be careful about that . That's an assertion based on your study and your reading . We don't want to frighten people , oh no . But what I'm saying is I've just got to be a bit careful about that Leading light on overnight .

Speaker 4 29:32

There is a direct link . There's direct links all the way through that . But what we've got to do is we've got to be very careful , because this light is impacting on our circadian rhythm . Now Matthew is lowering the light , lowering it right down , so that he's getting a low spike of blue light , which is making it a lot better for him . Those people that are sitting in the office at night with these bright blue lights on , even though you can't see it , with the white light that's got that blue in it , it is actually making these people . We're not designed to be awake at night full stop , so we need low light or we need no blue light . That's why these companies now are manufacturing and I can recommend a very good website for people to get a handle on as well which is circadiancom Circadiancom as well , which is circadiancom .

Speaker 1 30:19

Circadiancom . For those that work in supermarkets and things and shelves as they do overnight , are the lights fully blasting at that time of the night ?

Speaker 4 30:29

Yes , or are they dimmed ? What about the cleaners in office buildings that you can see that the lights are all on ?

Speaker 1 30:34

you can see those . Yeah , all right , we want to hear from cleaners . We want to hear from nurses , ambos we'd love to get your feedback as well . What are the conditions under which you work , particularly on shift work ? 133693 . It is Australia overnight . We'll get to Adi in just a moment . Interesting text here . Can you please tell me about the spelling of circadian ? So circadian is C-I-R-C-A-D-I-A-N , c-i-r-c-a-d-i-a-n Dot com . Recurring , naturally , a 24-hour cycle , even in the absence of light fluctuations . Circadian rhythms

The Impact of Light on Sleep

Speaker 1 31:12

. You made the point just while we were listening to the break there . Yep , one of the last things we all do day and or night . We go into a highly lit area , particularly at night , obviously , highly lit area . We clean our teeth , remove our makeup , then turn those lights off . But we've spent the last maybe 5 , 10 , 15 minutes in a highly lit area before going to the bedroom .

Speaker 4 31:35

Everyone , if you think about it , if everyone stops and thinks , and it's going to be a brain explosion moment for a lot of people . You sit and watch TV , low light , and then you think , oh , I'm going to go to bed . How many people go off , then have a shower with their bright lights on in their bathroom , in their en suite or whatever , or clean their teeth , do their hair , take their face off , put their night creams on , whatever , all with this bright light on it's the brightest room in the house and then we jump into bed , lie there with our phone like nine inches from our face , and then we think I can't sleep .

Speaker 1 32:08

It's very true , and I'm just thinking that when we were kids at the grandmother's house in particular , grandma and grandpa would turn the lights off to watch the TV . We no longer do that . No , we do not , because screens are different . They're brighter , happier , so there's no really need to turn light off to be able to see the screen .

Speaker 4 32:29

And the other thing too is , if you think about it , back then they were watching black and white TV as well . We are watching brilliant white and brilliant black TVs now as well , and that bright , bright light is just burning straight into our eyes .

Speaker 1 32:43

Claire makes the point Viatex says . Why can't nurses work normal hours Instead of double shift ? They are critical health workers . It would be perfectly understandable if they made mistakes when they're working such long hours . I remember at least 40 years ago I had a friend in school whose mother was a nurse and she would always say I am so tired . And she looked at . Clearly nothing has changed .

Speaker 4 33:09

I've got clients at the moment that are nurses doing double shifts 16 hour shifts , going in for the afternoon shift , ending up doing the night shift , driving home from work after a 16-hour shift . You don't understand . Your brain and your body is doing everything it can possibly do to try and get you to go to sleep . Everything it can possibly do . That micro nap could literally kill you or your children , and that's why it's so dangerous . Nurses do it because nurses , just by their very nature , don't feel like they want to let their team down , so what they do is they do their double shifts to take the pressure off the others so they're not the one that's left without .

Speaker 1 33:49

Arthur's one of our great contributors . Now , Artie , you're a shift worker and you've been doing it for a long time . When you get home , what do you do ? Do you rest straight away ?

Speaker 2 33:59

No , I don't . I put the TV on , watch the news . I've got a bit of insomnia . I don't mind it . So yeah , sometimes I do , sometimes I don't . But I'll get to the question with Roger at the moment . What's your opinion , roger ?

Speaker 4 34:18

I was a DJ in the club scene with lasers and strobes in your eyes over 30 years ? Great question . Yeah , that's an absolute ripper . It would depend on how much white or blue there was actually in the light . I guess you know it's something that's really interesting is we need a light I can't remember what they call it a spectronometer .

Speaker 1 34:36

A strobe .

Speaker 4 34:37

A special light meter tester that would actually not tell you the brightness of light , but it tells you the spectrum of light in it . Maybe it is a spectrometer and what they do is I've seen one of these working where he just went and pointed it at lights and it would show the blue spikes in light . Now , if you had that on but strobes , it can't possibly be good for you . Stimulating , stimulating , keeping the brain stimulated , the idea of going to sleep you say you've got insomnia . No wonder you've got insomnia if you were someone who is getting strobe lights going off , stimulating that brain all the time with light , movement , sparks , looking You're in a sympathetic state .

Speaker 1 35:20

Yeah , arthur , good call . Thank you very much for that . We'll talk later with some petrol prices . Arthur , when you go in and donate blood , as I've been doing for some years , I'm always sort of mesmerised by the fact that the place is lit up , presumably , and you're asked to be quite relaxed while you're donating blood or donating plasma , which takes a little longer when you do plasma , I think 45 minutes to 50 minutes that you could be in the chair , and so you're looking to be relaxed , but you're sitting under these blazing lights .

Speaker 4 35:51

Yes , but it's during the day , and it's during the day , and we need that . We want blue light during the day , we don't want it at night . Sorry , I should have clarified that . Let me just be clear , because there may be a misunderstanding there , and I might be to blame for this too . During the day , we want as much blue light as we can get .

Speaker 4 36:10

One of the biggest problems that we do have , though , is the lighting . Internal lighting in places during the day doesn't have enough blue light in it , which is why we need to step outside , into the sunshine . Into the sunshine , because the light outside has got anywhere between 2,000 and 10,000 lux of light , whereas inside it's only got about 400 to 600 or 400 to 800 lux of light . So we want this really , really strong blue to hit our melanopsin in our eyes , the melanopsin cells , which registers , believe it or not , the sky blue color . So that's what we want , which resets and triggers our circadian rhythm . Now , while you're in this blood bank giving blood and you're inside during the day obviously because you're not on night shift giving blood you want that blue light as much as you can get during the day , but you don't want that in an environment at night , like if you're working in a call centre , or if you're working in a hospital or an indoor job somewhere in an office . It's very tricky , but you don't want it .

Speaker 1 37:11

What about those of us that get home particularly no daylight saving ? You get home , you get to the bathroom and you think , well , I'll jump in the shower , and of course you're standing under one of those great heaters . I mean , it's bitterly cold . You're under one of those great heaters in the bathroom . Presumably what you're now saying is that's not great at 6.30 in the morning .

Speaker 4 37:30

No 6.30 in the morning is ideal because you want to reset that circadian rhythm early in the morning , Just prior to going to have a sleep . Oh no , not prior to going to have a sleep .

Speaker 1 37:37

That's what I'm saying .

Speaker 4 37:38

No , no , no , no , no . You wouldn't want that , because you want to be nice and relaxed and doing that . Now , if you put that heater on , have you thought about putting the salt lamp on in the bathroom ?

Speaker 1 37:47

Salt lamp Got to get me one of them , and showering in the salt lamp Got to anyone listening as well .

Speaker 4 38:01

That's the ideal solution . Share in the dark not in the pitch black , but put a light on elsewhere and shower in the dark and and get clean your teeth with a light on out away from you , so that you're not standing under this vivid white blue light at night before you go to bed .

Speaker 1 38:15

It's huge , isn't it ? Uh , it's exhausting I know there's so much to cover off .

Speaker 4 38:21

And people are going to go . Thank God he's going to work in a minute . Well , that's right .

Speaker 1 38:24

We're getting rid of him . Surely it's five to the hour

Online Presence and Podcast Promotion

Speaker 1 38:27

, roger ? I'm going to keep these lights dimmed , despite what Dennis Walter might say Now . Quickly , if people want to contact you , the best way to do that We'll find out what else you're doing online .

Speaker 4 38:37

They can keep up to date with me on Instagram at a underscore healthy underscore shift , and definitely through the website ahealthyshiftcom , and I've also got the podcast which I'm going to be doing a lot more of on A Healthy Shift , which is on all platforms . Thanks for having me , Tony Well done .

Speaker 1 38:56

We'll do it again in a couple of weeks . My friend , please don't say five to the hour . People hate that . I'm so sorry I did . It's coming up to one o'clock , coming up to half past twelve in South Australia . Thank you , good morning .