Shift Work and Health Seminars

Speaker 1 0:00

But right now the very popular night shift . Here we go , roger Sutherland . Gonna be some sweet times coming down on the night shift . I bet you're singing proud . Oh , I bet you're full of pride , roger . Have a look at the website ahealthyshiftcomau , where Roger coaches shift workers to thrive , not just survive , while working shift work as we do . A veteran law enforcement officer not one , not two , not three , but nearly four decades , roger . Good morning and good morning to you , tony . How are you ? This morning ? You've been on the beautiful Gold Coast conferencing .

Speaker 3 0:48

Five hours ago I was on the Gold Coast , so I miss the weather here , but I certainly know what it was like . It was magnificent up there for the last week . I went up there last Wednesday . You know what they say beautiful one day , perfect the next . It was literally that Until today , I was flying out to rain . Conference was held where , At the Star Casino , and it was amazing . Has anybody ever held a ?

Speaker 1 1:14

conference anywhere else but not the Gold Coast .

Speaker 3 1:16

I'm not sure where else that is . Where else is there ? I don't think there is anywhere else .

Speaker 1 1:21

There's Perth , there's some great conference space in Adelaide , some very great facilities right here in Melbourne .

Speaker 3 1:26

It's very attractive , the Gold Coast though , and there's a lot of great accommodation . When you've got all your Insta-famous people taking videos off the top and promoting the coast , why wouldn't you have it there ? It looked great . So the conference was about ? It was about health and fitness .

Speaker 3 1:48

It was the Clean Health Live fantastic organisation probably one of the leading educators for PTs as well as for personal trainers yeah , they certificate a lot of personal trainers and health professionals . They gathered some of the absolute best in the industry . I knew I was around my people when I was there for the last three days . I've heard some incredible talks from people around health and wellbeing and nutrition and social media and exploding on social media . It was a great conference . It was really well run .

Speaker 1 2:17

What would you say if there was a number one , two , three takeaway from five days ?

Speaker 3 2:22

I could give you a takeaway . I love that you've asked me this , because I literally have been asked this so many times and I'm going to give the same answer every single time . The one thing that we , as health professionals , do really struggle with is charging people because we want to help , we want to do and what's the right amount , like because we want to help , we want to do and what's the right amount and I think my mindset actually… .

Speaker 3 2:46

As a fee you mean as a fee ? Yeah , what do we charge people for our service ? And it's funny because the CEO of Clean Health stood up on the stage and said are the public benefiting from your service and your knowledge ? Yes , If so , get paid for it .

Speaker 1 3:03

And if we've got a healthy community or a healthier community , the burden is going to be nowhere as great on the purse of government .

Speaker 3 3:16

Now this is 100% correct and in fact , while I was up there , I've picked up a contract with Queensland Youth Justice up there working to run a seminar for them . Now I run health and wellbeing seminars in workplaces , 24-7 workplaces , and the reason why I do that is it increases productivity , it reduces unplanned leave , if we can reduce unplanned leave and just give people strategies around burnout , around stress and around compassion fatigue , which is huge now too , compassion fatigue and it's the worst . So , if I can run health and wellbeing seminars , what I do is I talk to people about strategies to work around the shift work , to work around how to go into , how to come out , how to put a boundary in place between work and home , how to put a boundary in place between work and home , how to put a boundary in place between home and work so that you are continually working to . Really , it just keeps you fresh for the job and , of course , when you're fresh for the job and people in the workplace are all on the same page around what they're doing , it just increases morale , increases productivity and that therefore , people are learning now how to go about doing shift work .

Speaker 3 4:29

Just remind us about unplanned leave . Well , unplanned leave is people that end up burnt out on work cover or stress . Also people who or sickies , sickies , just taking sickies because they just absolutely can't do it . Cost is horrendous Massive , massive Billions of dollars .

Speaker 3 4:44

Yeah , yeah , absolutely . Billions of dollars to private industry , and I'm here for it . I've come away from the conference on the weekend with some massive ideas .

Speaker 1 4:53

You're revved up , you're pumped .

Speaker 3 4:55

You're still on the path . I'm absolutely in a zone , coming back , and that's why we do it . I'm absolutely in a zone . I've got big plans and I want them all , a few of them . I've set a date .

Speaker 1 5:08

I want them in place by the 25th of August this year and that's to , if you were writing the script for how your model looks for a healthy shift . Have you got that in ?

Speaker 3 5:20

Well , you've had that there anyway , really I've been a little bit treading water in gumboots , I have been a little bit of . I'm here , but what am I actually going to do ? What am I going to do ? I know I've got all this knowledge , but what am I going to do ? But now I've literally laid it out now , so I'm ready , have a look at thehealthyshiftcom and we'll take your calls , we're so .

Speaker 1 5:40

We're going to talk about medications and sleep and the link between medications and sleep , but we thought we'd throw it open to the listener 133693 . And it probably requires a little bit of honesty , I guess if you had to say how many medications you take per day yeah , and I reckon most people , including myself , by the way , on some level of medication , you know when you go to a dentist . Well , I did it today at the dentist , yesterday at the dentist you know what medications you're on and I noticed , well , there's three .

Speaker 3 6:12

Yeah , I'm only on one . I take a supplement , but I'm supplements . Medication as opposed to supplements , but actual prescribed medications . What are we on ? Yeah , it's a really interesting one . I'm curious about the amount of people that take sleeping tablets as well .

Speaker 1 6:26

So we'll talk about that . 133693 . Doris , hello , you wanted to say good morning , hello . Yes , doris , go ahead . Tony here and Roger's here as well . Hi .

Speaker 6 6:34

Is that Roger ?

Speaker 1 6:35

Yes .

Speaker 3 6:36

Doris , how are you ? Roger the Dodger ?

Speaker 6 6:38

Sorry , no , I rang for one reason , but there's going to be about three things . One um , you talk about shift workers . Um , virtually mothers , parents , the shift workers , especially if you've got a baby . Um , so you've got to learn to not look at you , not look at your watch , but virtually listen to your body . So if you're tired , you rest . I don't take any medicines at all . I am zero , no , no vitamins , nothing . I use yoga , so if I want to go up or down , like do an upper or downer , there are certain poses that help . There are poses that help you sleep , poses that help you wake up . And also today they they actually said they've made a new discovery about schizophrenia bipolar . Would you believe ? 50 years ago I read an autobiography written by a schizophrenic whose lecturer boiled her schizophrenia down to toxins in her kidneys .

Speaker 6 7:47

Now that's 50 years old .

Speaker 3 7:48

Yeah , yeah . First of all , awesome , A really , really good call that the mothers of shift workers . A fantastic call ? Yeah it is . They absolutely are . Well , we've all come from a mother , End of story , and they've all had to get up in the middle of the night and not get those long sleeps . And you know , I totally while I'll never understand exactly what it's like , my heart goes out to them . Yoga I love that . You do yoga . I love this because my partner is actually a yoga instructor , so I learned a lot . I don't do yoga , Tony . I don't do yoga , but I really should . So I learned a lot . I don't do yoga , Tony . I don't do yoga , but I really should .

Speaker 1 8:25

So you haven't been roped into doing it no I haven't Mate , it's fantastic .

Speaker 3 8:29

I make it eat well .

Speaker 1 8:30

It's fantastic .

Speaker 3 8:31

Yeah , I know I do meditation and I don't know whether a lot of people understand , but yoga is actually the preamble into meditation . I really did , in 2024 , set a goal to learn yoga and I did . And I really do need to get Melissa to help me with my yoga because I need it for flexibility .

Speaker 1 8:52

So you live with an instructor I do , and when she goes and takes a class or is doing her own , you don't sit and do it .

Speaker 3 8:58

She will not let me go and do her class . She will not let me go . I've asked a couple of times can I come and do the class ? No , there you go , yeah , no .

Speaker 1 9:08

I think we need to explore that . On the Tony Mac couch really .

Speaker 1 9:11

Yes yes , I think so . 1-double-3-6-9-3 . Doris , thank you . Question is if you can be really brutally honest with us as part of this segment on how many medications are you ? I'll be interested to find out if there's people that are on more than three medications . Now we don't we don't need all the details of what what it is , but just generally what are the medications and for how long have you been on medications ? Just want to get some feedback for our own uh information . I think one , double three , six nine

Medication and Sleep Patterns

Speaker 1 9:43

, three . Australia , overnight . Rogers . Here I'm tony mcmahon . Good morning to everyone . Rogers , for our own information . I think 133693 , australia Overnight . Roger's . Here I'm Tony McManus . Good morning to everyone . Roger's . Here Roger Sutherland from ahealthyshiftcomau . You have a look at it Numerous resources there , links to help if you're working overnight and doing all sorts of various shifts . We've talked in the past about the great , wonderful nursing teams and people that work over there . There could be people that are drivers aviation drivers , as we know .

Speaker 1 10:07

Come and join us anytime . 133693 . We just want to throw it open as to the levels of medication , not necessarily what sort of medication , but the medications that people want for a range of conditions presumably , and we don't want to investigate , we just want to find out how much . Are some taking more than three to five medications per day ? I'm on three , but the one probably which many people would be things for indigestion is mine . Oh , really Okay yeah that's interesting , so I have one of those a day A little bit .

Speaker 3 10:39

Yeah , that can be really interesting People end up having to . I've got a partner not a partner , but a friend of mine that actually has to sleep almost sitting up because of the reflux , which is , and it helps . You know you can't be taking your Gaviscon every day , can ?

Speaker 1 10:55

you Well ? No , you can't . However , a little tablet and it's good , it helps , yeah , it does . For how long do you stay on that ? Well , that's right . And what does that then do , or that level of medication do , to your overall sense of ?

Speaker 3 11:08

well-being . Here's a question for you . Did you ask your doctor what is the best time to take it ? Because this is what we don't do , oh . Did I ask what time to take it ? Well , I take it in the morning , yeah , but do you just take it in the morning because it's convenient , or did your doctor say that that's the optimal time ? And the reason why I say this more and more and more research now around chronobiology and the optimal time to take particular medications like statins , you should speak to your doctor When's the best time to take it . With antidepressants , when's the best time to take it ? You should be speaking to your doctor about any medication that you're on . When's the optimal time to take it .

Speaker 1 11:45

A couple of quick calls , chris , in South Australia , morning Chris .

Speaker 9 11:49

Yeah , good morning . Yeah , you're talking about motivation speakers . We had one time amongst about 20-odd guys and he got up in front of us and said oh , you're feeling happy and you're feeling sad . And he did this about four times and we just looked at him . We thought you're not going to continue with this , are you ? And he sort of got the message and left oh , that's motivational . Yeah , that's what we thought too . Yeah , sleeping , I've got really bad sleeping habits . I might sleep , say , three hours a night and like I've had everything tonight , sort everything tonight , sort of , you know , the usual bit of milk and just relax and everything else like that . But I'm still awake , wide awake , and between now and you know , when I get up tomorrow , I might have , say , an hour's sleep and that's it .

Speaker 3 12:39

Yeah , poor sleep leaves clues , really really does . Your sleep leaves clues , really really does . And if I spent time with you and we went backwards over the last eight hours , there will definitely be clues as to why your circadian rhythm is so desynchronized . Without any doubt whatsoever , if you really really are serious about wanting to fix your sleep , you need to get up and expose yourself to early light every day and you need to get up , get moving and have breakfast , lunch and dinner at the breakfast , lunch and dinner time . You also need to get that blue light outside in the morning early , because this is what actually triggers our body's master clock and then , as you go through the day and keep going through the day in the evening you'll start to feel tired because that's the natural body's function and you'll get the melatonin coming . But the blue light , the stimulation there'll be a clue there somewhere .

Speaker 1 13:39

Chris , just in 10 words or less . Why do you think it is that you don't get that level of sleep that maybe you once enjoyed ?

Speaker 9 13:44

Well , I'll just answer one part first . I'm up 5.30 in the morning just about every day , yep , and I go for a walk with the dog , et cetera . Oh , that's good , yeah , and I've got a routine which I go through as to why I'm like this 37 years of driving a little steel box around you know , armoured vehicles .

Speaker 9 14:03

Yep , yeah , and I think that's got a lot to do with . You know you have a little bit of shift work , early start , late finishes and things like that you know . But you know just sort of it's got into a routine . After that I've gone to the chemist and got some , you know , sleeping tablets and things , but the doctor they won't prescribe you anything ? And so it goes on .

Speaker 3 14:29

Well , there is a reason , Chris , why a doctor won't prescribe sleeping tablets . In many cases , when you take a sleeping tablet , you're not actually sleeping . You're in a position where your body is unconscious and it doesn't go through the natural 90-minute sleep cycles that it needs to go through . We need to have five natural sleep cycles , which are of 90 minutes each . That's our ultradian rhythm , which runs daytime and nighttime as well . Every 90 minutes it changes , and that's the thing that there's going to be something somewhere in your day that is causing it . Whether it's stress , whether it's , it doesn't sound like If you're getting up and walking your dog early . It sounds like you're on top of it .

Speaker 1 15:08

Yeah well , you would have thought so . This is all irrespective of age , demographic too , of course it doesn't make a difference , does it ? Very much so , damien Maidstone morning .

Speaker 2 15:17

Good morning . How are you guys ? We're well . I worked in a hospital pharmacy for 21 years Wow .

Speaker 7 15:23

Yep .

Speaker 2 15:24

And I also suffered from bipolar for the last 17 . Yep , so I've been on a lot of medication . At the moment I'm on epilim , abilify Lipitor , and I was also on lithium . I was on Cyprexa , which put on 20 kilos of weight yeah Holy dooly , that's devastating .

Speaker 1 15:45

What was your role in the pharmacy , damon ? As a technician .

Speaker 3 15:48

Okay , we do exactly what the pharmacists do , but they get paid more , you would have seen a lot of what people are taking too . Obviously you know what the medications are . Sometimes it must just make your well hair curl or eyes roll with some of the medications , or the amounts of medications , Especially the older generation too , you know . Just what they take . Yeah .

Speaker 2 16:11

You've got to take this to counter for that to counter for this .

Speaker 3 16:13

Yep , that's right . Yeah , yeah . So they want you to take like anti-inflammatories , but they also want you to take a particular medication to counteract so it doesn't rot your stomach . I know there's a lot of things that older people they nearly rattle when they walk . There's so many pills in them . So yeah , I just thought I'd give you a buzz .

Speaker 1 16:33

I'm pleased you did . That's very kind of you to do so , damien . Yeah , see , everybody's got a story . There's a great one here from a text from Shane who says antidepressants been doing that for 15 years and that's a great thing that they're available . Oh yeah , but there's not too many listening that at some point haven't had that little tablet just to level life out a little bit . I think I call it a leveler .

Speaker 3 16:54

I have no shame in admitting that I've been on an antidepressant for the last three years and I've got to tell you people should never fear being on an antidepressant .

Speaker 1 17:03

No of course not Also a cholesterol tablet . Also take vitamins glucosamine for arthritis , multivitamin fish oil . Damien D , Well done . Thank you , shane , for that message . John Nanagoon .

Speaker 4 18:10

Morning Johnny . Good morning everyone . Now I'm 64 . Just been diagnosed with diabetes . I thought I had a

Health Concerns and Safety Worries

Speaker 4 18:19

pretty good run but I shouldn't have got it . I'm 140 kilos and 6 foot 2 , so I'm well overweight . I've been put on two tablets a day for diabetes . I've not been in an injection .

Speaker 1 18:34

Johnny , just move slightly to your left . We've got a really bad line there . We want to hear what you've got to say , so tell us about the weight . Do you do anything about the weight ? Is that something that's in the back of your mind , that you'd like to somehow have that addressed ?

Speaker 4 18:47

Well , I'd like to have it addressed , but I've got a blood clot in my leg so it's very hard to walk . It's very hard to exercise , yeah .

Speaker 3 18:55

But if we look at this and this is a really good warning for people as well what are you taking ? Metformin for your diabetes ? Yeah , metformin yeah , that's just increasing the insulin . So a lot of people don't understand how diabetes actually works and how we get to that stage . This is key for shift workers as well . We've got to be very careful because we are putting food into our system overnight and we are very insulin resistant , so that glucose is going around our system .

Speaker 3 19:22

Shift workers are highly , highly likely to end up with type 2 diabetes , which is obviously what Damien's ended up with . Damien John , sorry , yeah , it's what we end up with . And if you think about it , imagine , by the sound of it , you're out driving now , so you're sedentary , and when you're sedentary and you're eating and you're not exercising , we end up with blood clots in our legs . We end up with type 2 diabetes . It does catch up with us Shift work catches up with us if we don't do something about it along the way . And , unfortunately , once you cross the Jordan with your type 2 diabetes , there's no going back at all . It's now something that you've got to check and treat every single day .

Speaker 1 20:07

Johnny , wish you well . Keep in touch with the program . It's always good to hear your voice . We'll take more calls the other side 133693 . Those messages coming through from Julie . I'm 64 . Four medications for the past 10 years Antidepressants , blood pressure , breast cancer prevention , warfarin and cutia . So there's four and Julie's only 64 . Will you still leave me ? Will you still need me when I'm 64 ?

Speaker 1 20:37

64 , that's right , julie , we love you . Thank you for that . It's great by way of feedback and , by the way , four medications is at the lower end of the scale based on a lot of the text coming through .

Speaker 3 20:47

Absolutely yes .

Speaker 1 20:49

We will do this . More of your calls the other side of Australia overnight . Roger Sutherland's here talking about the HeartShift thehealthyshiftcom . Have a look at the website if you'll find it fascinating . Christine in Geelong , good morning .

Speaker 10 21:02

Yes , good morning . How are you ?

Speaker 1 21:03

Really well , say hello to Roger .

Speaker 10 21:06

Hello Roger , I'm so sorry I didn't know your name . I do have a little bit of a story . I'll be quick . I lived in a block of commission units of seven . I was up the front for five years . I had a heart attack due to a neighbour . Then they moved me down to seven . It's in the same block but for the last four and a half years I've been having this mysterious knocker .

Speaker 1 21:31

Sorry , Christine , you've been having what ?

Speaker 10 21:33

People , a person knocking at my window , my doors , oh dear , and I don't mix . I'm basically a loner and the police can't help me , human services can't help me . But , wow , you know , I'm at my wits' end because I heard you talking about sleep and what happens is , if it goes on through the day , I might have to sleep every day instead of night , and it's really mucking me up . The police , they were very strong to put up with the four and a half years , Christine .

Speaker 1 22:05

for four and a half years you've been .

Speaker 10 22:07

I know , yes , it's been going on and every time I think it's stopped . It might stop for four weeks , then it's off again , you know , and we were originally the elderly people and then they moved from Utenasim and somebody said to me get out there with a torch . Well sorry , I don't think that's very safe to go outside .

Speaker 1 22:27

I don't know who told you that . Just by way of feedback . Have you got some thoughts ? I mean , it's just a lot of people . It's not dissimilar situation really .

Speaker 3 22:36

Well , they're just . Yeah , a lot of people are like that out in the community and they're terrified , they're just scared , and I think a lot of things that happen as well is watching the news .

Speaker 1 22:44

The question is for me just on . That is the fear real .

Speaker 3 22:48

No , it's not there you go . That's exactly what I was going to say . And the media generates a lot of and don't get me wrong , we're media , but the media generates a lot . People watch this , they absorb it , and I was going to talk about that . If people are actually fearing and living in that fear , they have to turn that fear around as well . So they've got to start thinking positive about different things and filling their cup that way so that the neuroplasticity in their brain is actually starting to think positive and starting to get rid of that fear , because we can literally live in fear if we believe it . But is it right , like you just said ? It's not right , uh so do you have ?

Speaker 1 23:29

do you talk to anybody during the day , christine , or are you mostly alone ?

Speaker 10 23:34

uh , I'm mostly alone , but I'm not . It's never scared me , because they've never attempted to get in To me . It's like , for some reason , they want to wake me up , but I don't know why . But I've never been scared . That's the whole point , and so I've put up with it . I've got one neighbour . She's well aware of what is going on , but , as I said , when it comes to the police and with the housing , it's very , very difficult . I can't just move , if you understand what I mean . But that's one thing that's never scared me . I just think well , okay , I can't even plan an early night . If I do , I could get a knock at the door at 10 o'clock or a window . I wake up straight away and therefore I find it hard to get back to sleep .

Speaker 1 24:20

Clearly . Do you feel safe ? That's my important question to you . Clearly , not always .

Speaker 10 24:27

The reason I do feel safe . I think it's more psychological . Whoever this person is not with me ? But whoever this person is , I think what is wrong with you ? Why do you want to disturb my sleep ? There's elderly ladies around here . She was getting a few doorbell rings for a while . Then that stopped , but I can't understand why this would happen to me . I live alone and I don't really mix with people . I'm thinking I don't really understand it , but wow , has it not ? It's really affected my sleeping . As I said , I'm not scared , no , but I think as to why . I try and work out reasons why .

Speaker 3 25:09

Roger , have you got any feedback on that ? Have you ever seen anybody ? Chris Stone , have you like . Have you ever seen anybody ?

Speaker 1 25:15

What do you mean ? Seen anybody ?

Speaker 3 25:16

Have you seen anybody ? What do you mean ? Seen anybody ? Have you seen anybody ? You've heard the door knocking . You've heard the door knocking . You've heard the doorbell go . You've had the types on the window . Have you ever actually seen anybody ? And the reason being is because if you haven't seen anybody , is there really someone there ?

Speaker 10 25:30

Oh yeah , there is because they knock fairly loud and I live like down the back where there's tennis courts loud , and I live like down the back where there's tennis courts . No one would see them . And I know which , you know I can always tell which window it is because they knock fairly loudly . But because these ladies , they're sort of my bedrooms , I actually sleep on the couch , yeah .

Speaker 1 25:51

How often does this happen ?

Speaker 10 25:54

It can happen twice a week . Last night it was at nine o'clock . There were four bangs on my window . Last Tuesday it went on all day and the police said they really feel that it's a neighbour here . But you can't just go accusing someone .

Speaker 1 26:10

So long as the police have been involved . That's the important thing . Yeah , that's the most important thing At least they're aware .

Speaker 3 26:15

That's the main thing .

Speaker 1 26:21

And I'm sure they're patrolling around shining their lights around for you . Christine , it's lovely to talk to you . Keep in touch with the program and feel free to call anytime 133693 . Some really interesting messages coming through , liz . I won't give all the details , liz , except to say I'm taking some medication for epilepsy once a night , once in the morning and a few vitamins during the day . I am a night owl , not a big fan of waking up much before about 8.30 . I cope quite well , roughly on six or more hours of sleep a night . On days when I don't have commitments I do enjoy a nap of sleep , which means getting up around after 9.30 in the morning . My average bedtime is about 1 am and I'm only 30 .

Speaker 3 26:56

Classic night owl . That's a classic night owl person . Nothing wrong with that if that's your routine and you stick to it , right ? So we have just looking at that . There probably doesn't start to feel tired until about 11.30 midnight . So while you and I go not me , barley Charlie I'm going to bed early , if I get the chance there are people who are night owls . I used to be a night owl very much that I would come alive at night , hence why .

Speaker 1 27:24

I'm shivering , but your work during those days demanded that be the case .

Speaker 3 27:28

Well , that's right , but I was . I thrive and we need to work with and at 30 years of age Liz is 30 , which she's told us here . She is someone who isn't in the prime demographic as a night owl , and we become a night owl until we start to age . We hit about 50 , 55 . Then we start to become that early bird again . Our circadian rhythm naturally shifts around into the earlies , but what I would highly discourage is the sleep in , because you can't catch up on sleep .

Speaker 1 28:00

Yeah , very good point . Okay , uh , thank you for that . One . Double three , six , nine three . Uh , I noticed that in the last few months we started to have dinner about a past five , quarter past five . We say here we go , we'll have a very early dinner . Love , we might watch the news at six or nine , we might go and have a nap , yep , to be able to come back in .

Speaker 3 28:18

That's what tells you . That's exactly . But we do do that . That's ageing , don't get me wrong , but we do . We become earlier birds and as long as you're making the most of getting to bed when you've controlled the controllables is what I talk to people about so while you're on night shift , you've got a routine .

Speaker 1 28:35

Yeah , it's like the dentist yesterday said oh well , you're going pretty well , your gums are receding a little bit . Yeah , which was a nice way of saying you're actually getting very long in the tooth . Thank you very much , mr Dentist . We'll be back shortly . 1-double-3-6-9-3 . It is Australia Overnight , good morning , Good morning . Good morning . I'm Tony McManus . Roger Sutherland is here for Night Shift healthyshiftcom . Have a look at what Roger does there . I think you'll find it fascinating . So much to cover off . That is the true story . Thank you to Dr Patrick , he said , hence the expression long in the tooth .

Speaker 3 29:12

Oh no , honestly , I've heard the expression . I didn't realise it was real . Yes , so I walked out there .

Speaker 1 29:18

Thank you , doctor .

Speaker 8 29:20

I don't like it .

Speaker 1 29:21

Scott in Greensboro Morning . Scott Say hello to Roger .

Speaker 3 29:25

Good morning Roger , Morning Scott . How are you this morning ? I'm well , Excellent .

Speaker 1 29:31

How can we help ?

Speaker 5 29:33

What's on your mind ? I was with two Catholic priests , a neighbour , three family members , a stranger I can't go into it . No , eight people . And anyway , I've been through like so many psychiatric units and had shock therapy and all that .

Speaker 1 29:52

Just approximately what age are you , Scotty ? I'm 55 . And do you live alone now ? No , I'm looking after my dad , oh , you're a good man , but you have some ongoing health issues mental health issues which are being addressed .

Speaker 5 30:09

I'm on disability support pension . I have post-traumatic stress disorder . Yeah . I'm on . I take Valium to calm my nerves and that helps obviously . I take some stuff to make me go to sleep . It's called Cloxprime or something , but I don't know .

Speaker 1 30:31

So how do you fill in your day ? Pretty much Scotty .

Speaker 5 30:36

I like to write poems and stories and things . Good on you . Do you do a bit of reading ? I do some gardening .

Speaker 1 30:45

Well , there you go , out in the fresh air and the sun .

Speaker 3 30:50

Well done , Scott .

Speaker 1 30:51

Well , scott , you've got it going on . So what's the on the downside , then , how would you describe your life on a scale of 1 to 10 , with 10 being brilliant , 1 being a bit of a challenge ? Where would you sit in between 1 and 10 if you had to describe that on a piece of paper ?

Speaker 5 31:07

No , forget about all that .

Speaker 1 31:09

Or ballpark . I'm just asking the question between 1 and 10, . How's your life going ?

Speaker 5 31:13

When Dad goes , then I can commit suicide .

Speaker 1 31:17

No well , scotty , we don't want that to happen . Make sure and I promise you you can call any time If you feel like that . I urge you and encourage you to call Lifeline and those dark thoughts and you know many people have them from time to time , scott but I want you to be part of the program 13 11 14 . 13 11 14 and give Lifeline a call . But you're more than welcome to call this program anytime and be part of the great 3AW family . Scott , you can tell there are some ongoing . How do I say this ? Not issues

Importance of Routine for Shift Workers

Speaker 1 32:01

is the wrong word . What's ?

Speaker 3 32:02

a better word than issues Challenges . I guess I think we need to give Scott some credit as well .

Speaker 10 32:06

I think he's looking after his father .

Speaker 3 32:08

He's looking after his father . That's amazing . I mean , what a credit to him , because it's just as easy to walk away from that role as well when you're not coping well with life , but he's actually looking after his father , who clearly needs him , needs him a lot . I think that's something that's really really good . He loves his garden , gets out the garden , counts on it .

Speaker 1 32:28

It does .

Speaker 3 32:29

Really , really important . So , scott , if you're still listening , well done , yeah , congratulations .

Speaker 1 32:33

I really important so .

Speaker 3 32:34

Scott , you know if you're still listening . Well done , congratulations .

Speaker 1 32:36

I agree . The importance of routine comes up , things like sleep hygiene , I guess . What's the link around the idea of routine ? What does that do ?

Speaker 3 32:46

based on your enormous amount of reading and study , all right . So I think the question is do you have a routine when you go to , when you're preparing for bed ? Do you have a routine that you follow every time that you go to bed ? Yes , I do , you do and you go through it , and this is one of the reasons why people do sleep . If you go through the same routine and we call this sleep hygiene , for whatever reason , because when I think hygiene , I think you're dirty- or clean , have a good wash , have a good shower .

Speaker 3 33:12

Yeah , but we call it sleep hygiene , and sleep hygiene is imperative for our body . Now , a lot of people have a routine , like when you finish , you go , finish here , you drive home , you listen to music , you're driving your car , you're doing whatever , but we need a routine when we get home .

Speaker 3 33:31

Routine will set you free Absolutely Every time . Because when we get home , routine will set you free Absolutely Every time . Because when we're scatterbrained because a lot of people I know from a lot of shift workers that have had intense nights , highly stressed , highly strung jump in the car and listen to the doof-doof music all the way home , still stimulating themselves , got the light walk in , scroll on the phone while they're scoffing breakfast , no idea what they're doing , climbing into bed , lying there , looking at their phone and then roll over and expect the body to go to sleep . And we're trying . It's almost like driving at 100 mile an hour and hitting the brake and expecting to stop on a 20 cent piece . We can't do that . So we need routine , and once people understand the importance of having a routine , putting a routine in place , and that can come down to like with the ladies taking their makeup off , um , putting on their night creams , the body's response to the smells , um , and things like that , um , and also then we climb into there .

Speaker 3 34:29

So we thought of it . But yes , yeah , the body responds . Oh so this is the sleep night cream . The body does get used to it . Plus , you've got to remember , we know that we're preparing for sleep because we're putting those creams on . Plus we go to bed . Now I don't know whether you do or not , but we've got a lavender spray Spray the lavender spray .

Speaker 1 34:48

A great fan , I've become a convert . Gerald Quigley suggested this late last year . And I've been putting the lavender on three or four sprays on the pillow .

Speaker 3 34:58

Gone inside five to ten , lots of evidence around lavender spray . So anybody out there that's listening that does struggle to fall asleep . Lavender is associated with relaxation and sleep Works .

Speaker 1 35:09

really , really well , david , good morning to you and thank you for joining us .

Speaker 12 35:13

Morning gents . Just actually we finished work early tonight . I'm just on the way home . Just a quick question with regards to night shift and so forth . So I work in construction with the Suburban Rail Loop and I swap a lot between days and nights , days and nights , fairly regularly and I tend to sleep fairly well once I get home , let's say in the morning , I'll put an eye mask on , put some earbuds in and I'm out for about six or seven hours . But if you're chopping and changing , look , I seem to cope okay . But I was just curious , you know , can it be detrimental ? Or if you're coping , you're coping .

Speaker 3 35:53

No . I seem to be coping fine with it , yeah , but your body's not .

Speaker 1 35:57

And in fairness to , or you run the risk of .

Speaker 3 36:00

Yeah , you run Over time , that will catch up with you because it's going to cause metabolic problems to you and you need to . And this is where I'm working in the future , tony , with corporates . I want to work in the future to strip these environments with these rosters down and start putting forward rotating rosters in . So people do days , then they do nights and then they have days off . Days , then nights and then days off , because a forward rotation roster , but doing a day , then a couple of nights , then a day off , and then a day , then a couple of nights , or a couple of nights , a rest day , day off , it's all over the shop .

Speaker 3 36:34

Not good for your system , because your circadian rhythm counts on regularity , so David .

Speaker 1 36:41

So your work , presumably by definition , becomes a little random . The hours yeah , correct .

Speaker 12 36:48

So currently a lot of the work that we're doing , if we've got to do work say , for example , tonight we had to remove some concrete barriers so that's got to be done at night . If we've got some electrical work , for example , it has to be done at night , so they'll call us in to do night and I put my hand up and say , yep , no problems , I'll come in . And look , I try and look after myself and go to the gym when I wake up and all that sort of stuff . But I was just curious , yeah , look , we don't really have much control over it . And look , sometimes it might only be , say , two nights in a week . I think in the next two weeks I've got two weeks straight , which , once you get into the routine , it helps a hell of a lot .

Speaker 3 37:34

It does . Routine is everything .

Speaker 1 37:37

Routine will set you free , David . We've got to do this because we've got the news not far away . But wish you well , Keep in touch .

Speaker 7 37:43

Thank you .

Speaker 1 37:44

Well done , david . Driving home from shift work this time of the morning . Are you going to hang around for a little while I can hang around , We'll take more of your calls 133693 .

Speaker 1 37:55

Just thank you for all those people talking about levels of medication . There's questions there about yoga , those that are night owls . There's a 60-year-old Angela . We'll get to your text in just a moment about low-dose blood pressure . Lots more . 133693 . The text line 0477 693 693 . Yo , the one and only Roger , sutherland Night Shift . Have a look at healthyshiftcom . We'll kick on for a little bit with us in the next hour . You can come and play as well . Look forward to your company Now . This is Australia Overnight with Tony McManus . Roger is here . I'm Tony McManus . If you would like to be part of the program 133693 , all things to do with health and wellness , I guess in a sense , but certainly for those that are shift workers and there are many , whether you've done shift work , you're doing shift work feel free to be part of the program 133693 . A lot of texts coming through , rog . Yes , your partner says one can teach you yoga at home . Much more fun , not timetabled .

Speaker 3 39:08

We'll read into that and take that for what it's worth . Thank you .

Speaker 1 39:11

Morning tone Normally I sleep Bit of twister , thank you . I normally sleep what it's worth , thank you . Morning tone Normally I sleep Bit of twister , thank you . Normally sleep Around about

Importance of Sleep and Breathing

Speaker 1 39:17

five hours , start work 3am through until 5pm , only after five hours sleep . But on the weekend , love that afternoon nap , just like in Italy ending in 004 . Thank you for that . Gotta say loving that nap .

Speaker 3 39:32

Oh yeah , the nap is gold .

Speaker 1 39:34

30 minutes up to 30 minutes or 90 minutes Perfect that 90 minutes just refreshes , and then you feel like you've got this new lease in life . Absolutely why didn't we need to do that , though , when we were 21 ?

Speaker 3 39:46

Yeah , it's an interesting one , isn't it ? Why do we love that nap now , and we're known for it . The older we get , aren't we ? We're known for it , the older we get , aren't we ? We're known for popping on the couch and having a 30 minute push in the .

Speaker 1 39:56

Z From Ange turned 60 last October . Low dose blood pressure medication for about six years . Since then blood pressure has been well and truly under control . That's comfortable , and I can't see the rest of that text . Right now in the bottom there , benny , thank you Also . Take on rare occasions . Valium relaxes me also . Puts Right now in the bottom there , benny , thank you Also . Take on rare occasions . Valium relaxes me also . Puts me to sleep at night . Another one says hi , I consider myself a night owl , not a sparrow . I'm also inclined to being resistant , feel myself nodding off , but simply cannot enter a tight sleep , a light sleep or a nana nap .

Speaker 3 40:35

Nor can I nana nap Really In fact I could do one now , so could I .

Speaker 1 40:40

Absolutely I could , Having said that yesterday was an interesting day , Just a share , share , like a bear Home bite to eat some scrambled , some eggs and enjoy protein and carbs .

Speaker 1 40:55

Perfect , yeah , and you know , hang out with the people in the shared home , shared house and then nap right through from about 7.30 through until about 1 , so about a six-hour straight Off to the dentist I did go . Then you have the dentist in the dentist chair for an hour , and then the evening and then another hour and a half . Yeah , this is so . It is a split shift , so you no longer do that eight sort of hour solid during the day , or haven't been able to yet .

Speaker 3 41:23

Okay . So what's optimal ? That is the question here . And it's a really interesting question too , tony , because everyone's different , all right , and it depends . What you're doing is what I've done for 40 years in my shift working life . So I have always gone straight home , eaten , gone to bed and got about somewhere between five and six hours , and then I've got up . So I would get to bed about 7 o'clock , sleep through until about 12.31 , get up . I'd go about doing the dentist , the appointments and how good is it that you can make appointments whenever you want because you're a shift worker ? It's the best , isn't it ? That's the upside .

Speaker 3 42:02

It is the absolute upside , because how many times you can ring up and you make an appointment and they say , oh , we've only really got 2.10 . You go , I'll take it , and no traffic , no traffic . You can park . That's the other upside too . Yeah , you can do that . And then , if you're a gymmer , you can go to the gym , but then going back for that nap for that hour and a half before you go back to work . This is the key for a shift worker that two nap it still adds up and it's 90 minutes works perfectly .

Speaker 1 42:28

Come and join us . 133693 . 133693 . We . One double three , six , nine three . One double three , six , nine three . We just did a bit of a straw poll and the feedback's been incredible If you've just woken up for the first time or joined the program for the first time . We just thought we'd take a look at medication on . How many medications are you on ? We've had three through to six and seven various medications , yep . So one double three , six , nine three . But anything you want to raise on the program , tiktok , click time is modern disease . Very good point . Absolutely , we need to get back to baby time , which means listening to our bodies .

Speaker 3 43:04

Right Now . I want to talk about this because this is a really really good point . Now . A lot of people just don't realise how much time we waste . In fact , let's have a look at it Millions and millions , in fact billions of dollars are spent by these social media platforms to keep us on them . Yeah , that's right .

Speaker 3 43:23

It's designed to keep us on them . Dopamine hit . I mean . You have a look at it . Facebook Meta actually got in trouble for using these hooks to hold people onto the platform all the time and if you ever noticed , if you're an Instagram , it's like another form of addiction . In many ways , I reckon , it's not even another form , it is actually an addiction .

Speaker 1 43:38

It's an addiction , yeah .

Speaker 3 43:39

Because we're chasing the dopamine hit Our phones . These phones provide us with a dopamine hit . How many times do you send a message in the anticipation of waiting for the reply ? And then , how many times can you be in the middle of talking to someone and you hear ding and you think , oh , I want to look at it . I want to look at it , but I can't . Am I allowed to pick up my phone ? And this is what actually happens to a lot of people . We are absolutely goddamn addicted to our phones . We can't leave it alone . We've got to grab it , pick it up and look at it . But these platforms like TikTok , even things like Pinterest , facebook have you ever noticed that when you read a caption or you read something and then you go back , the feed's refreshed and that's designed to keep you actually on it . You can open your phone . I say in the morning sky before screen . It's got to be sky before screen and that is oh .

Speaker 1 44:30

I'm going to write that down on the T-shirt .

Speaker 3 44:32

Sky before screen yeah , always . And the reason why we need this is because we need to wake our brain and wake our body up before we start looking at this stuff on our phone . Set the agenda to the day . So what I say is put the music on to dance to . Don't dance to the music that's playing . Right , it's a good one . Hang on to that . I love that . Do that one more time I love it . Go on , put the music on . Set the music to dance to . Don't dance to the music that's playing .

Speaker 1 44:58

Oh , I love it . Yeah , I knew you would . It's a music trick that is fantastic .

Speaker 3 45:08

Yeah , yeah . And the reason being is because what you want people lie in bed , open their phone and start reading their emails before they even Get up . They haven't even woken up .

Speaker 1 45:17

Yeah , it's true , breathing's the other one . Have you and I talked a lot about breathing .

Speaker 3 45:22

I don't think we've talked about breathing at all . No , oh geez , it's so important . It's so important .

Speaker 1 45:26

We've lost the art of breathing .

Speaker 3 45:28

We don't breathe well . Has written a book called Breath yeah .

Speaker 3 45:32

Breath . Have you read it ? It's sitting beside the bed . Open it up , read it . In fact , even better if you've got it on an audio book , listen to it on the way to work and back . We , as humans , have lost the art of how to breathe and I think what you will realise anyone that gets into bed and you're wanting to go to sleep , put your hand on your navel and breathe down into the hand on your navel . We used to do that in school as kids .

Speaker 1 45:58

Yes , we did .

Speaker 3 45:58

Yes , we did .

Speaker 1 45:59

Where you'd had your hands on your tummy , across your navel , breathing in , breathing out , so that your fingers would touch as you were doing that . Do you know why ? Good morning , sister Jean . I'm sure it was a nun thing that used to put us through those routines .

Speaker 3 46:14

Well , I can tell you , clever , because when you go out into the playground and you're playing , you're actually putting yourself into a sympathetic state , right . So because you're breathing , you know you're running around , because back in our day we never used to sit , well , we did just sit behind the shoulder shed if the girls were there . But what we would do is we would be out playing kicking a football , playing cricket , running around chasing the girls , right . But when you come back in , if you put your hand on your navel and you breathe in for four seconds but breathe down into that hand , you will literally feel your digestive tract relax because you're putting yourself , you're activating that vagus nerve and you're relaxing your whole body , putting it back into the rest and digest , and then you can focus properly , because you can't concentrate while you're in a sympathetic state .

Speaker 1 47:03

What were the games you used to play at school ? 1-double-3-6-9-3? . There's one game that was actually banned in school .

Speaker 3 47:12

Brandy with the ball no . Tennis ball no . Tennis ball no . Zing someone with a tennis ball on the back of the loo ? No , it wasn't , but we did that . That was great , was it ? Kiss Chosey , tony 1-double-3-6-9-3 .

Speaker 1 47:25

1-double-3-6-9-3 . I reckon we'll get lots of calls about those games you played in the schoolyard back in the day . This is a 7 , 8 , 9 , 10 , 11-year-olds , I reckon prior to senior school . Was it British Bulldogs 1-3-3 . Well , I know you . I want the listeners to play .

Speaker 4 47:41

Well , I just had a guess . I never said let's just ruin that segment .

Speaker 1 47:45

Thanks , Benny .

Speaker 5 47:47

Oh , it was .

Speaker 3 47:49

British Bulldog yeah , yeah . And then Simon Says what Dog ? Yeah , yeah .

Speaker 1 47:52

And then Simon Says what was Simon Says ?

Speaker 3 47:54

When you had to keep on taking steps and then Simon would turn around . Simon Says take 10 steps or something oh yes , I think that's how it went . I forget how it went now . I thought that was what's the Time , Mr Wolf . Oh , what's the Time ? Mr Wolf , that's right , ben's right there . Thank you , oh my God , thank you , thank God , you're here , benny , you just ruined the whole segment .

Speaker 1 48:14

No it's still a good segment .

Speaker 11 48:17

It's just there are a million and one different types of games .

Speaker 1 48:19

I reckon that was the one , certainly at school , at St Michael's from memory in Ashburton , where they said no , we won't be playing that game on the asphalt , no more British Bulldog . But there was one more , a different version of British Bulldog 133693 , that you would have played at school . That was ultimately . It may , but not everybody would have banned it , presumably , but it was considered that we promoted that we don't play that particular version of the game .

Speaker 3 48:46

I don't think they can play anything now , Ken . I don't know . I think it's got so PC now that we can't do anything at school ?

Speaker 1 48:51

Well , do they have that amount of space in the school to be able to do it ? I guess is the other thing too .

Speaker 10 48:55

I don't know 133693 .

Speaker 1 48:58

It is Australia Overnight . Good morning Morning tone . British Bulldogs was named at school . Yes , that's the one , but there was another version and I'm still waiting for I reckon it was called Hoppo Bumpo .

Speaker 3 49:10

Hoppo Bumpo .

Speaker 1 49:11

Hoppo Bumpo .

Speaker 3 49:12

Hoppo Bumpo .

Speaker 1 49:13

Yep , which was a similar thing . We had to get through the other group , but only hopping . You had to keep your feet together and you had to cross your arms , holding your arms .

Speaker 3 49:22

So you had no balance , no balance , you'd fall over all the time .

Speaker 1 49:24

We could do that now when we were 10 . Without a problem in the world . Thank you to you . Trev says he was and I'll proceed this pretty good at that game . Jenna from Sydney says hello , jen , nice to have you on the program . Was the game Cocky Laura ? Don't ever know that . What was Cocky Laura , jen ? You'll have to give us more information . I've never heard of Cocky Laura . What was Cocky Laura ? Might have been a Sydney game .

Speaker 3 49:51

Well , they're strange up there anyway aren't they ?

Speaker 1 49:55

Yeah or don't we love them . Thank you , lara , lara or Laura . Thank you , vern in Morwell . Good morning , vernie , hi how are you going ? Tony , yeah , really well , roger's here . Roger's here to talk all things to do with shift work and sleeping overnight and healthy breathing and just generally chew the fat Vern . What have you got ?

Speaker 11 50:13

Well , actually sorry , roger . I have been listening to you , roger , but yeah , sometimes you have a good think about it , you forget . You know , if you really want to go into it , you can sort of forget how to breathe , you can yeah , we were just talking about during the break .

Speaker 1 50:36

Do you deliberately breathe these days , vern , or just do it as most of us do , incidentally ?

Speaker 11 50:44

No , I just breathe to try and stay alive . But I tell you what I tell you it's conducive to good living , isn't it ?

Speaker 3 50:50

Yeah ?

Speaker 1 50:52

it is Go on , vern . What were you going ?

Speaker 11 50:53

to say Well , I tell you you that , yes , I went to St Mary's in Ashburton as well , and it was a lovely school .

Speaker 1 51:04

St Michael's .

Speaker 11 51:05

Oh yeah , what did I say ?

Speaker 1 51:07

St Mary's , yeah , St Michael's .

Speaker 11 51:10

In Ashburton With the old off shop across the road Just on . Victory Boulevard , the corner of .

Speaker 1 51:16

Victory Boulevard and High Street .

Speaker 11 51:20

But what I was going to say was oh heck , it's crossed my mind now . There was a topic . What was the topic ? You were talking about it . You were talking about it . We were talking about games .

Speaker 1 51:38

Games that you might have played inside the playground Poison ball .

Speaker 3 51:43

Oh yes , oh yeah , Poison ball yeah .

Speaker 1 51:46

So was that with the tennis ball or the larger Basketball , basketball , basketball , yeah , is that the one you're thinking of .

Childhood Games and Breathing Techniques

Speaker 11 51:54

It was a basketball , but it was fairly solid .

Speaker 10 51:58

Oh yeah .

Speaker 11 51:58

And you get a bloke in the middle and you've got to try and knock him over like a ten-pin bowling , you know .

Speaker 3 52:05

Well , you only had to hit them . But the goal for the boys was to knock each other off their feet .

Speaker 1 52:10

Yeah , and it was done with quite . I think it was a basketball , or quite a heavy ball , quite a heavy basketball , yeah . And then , and if you got hit , you'd leave , you'd leave the arena and it was one person standing . We used to do that at scouts . It was great at scouts .

Speaker 3 52:24

No wonder there was no obesity crisis when we were running around doing that at one time Very good point , we do that every day Vern good on you .

Speaker 1 52:31

Well done . Just going back to the breathing , you and I were talking about it during the ad break . Breathe in through the nose and out through the nose , or are you exhaling through the mouth ?

Speaker 3 52:39

No , in through the nose and out through the nose .

Speaker 3 52:44

So , nose for both Nose in and out . Okay , now , when you read the book that's called Breath by Tony Nesta in fact , if you're a podcast listener if anyone's a podcast listener search for Tony Nesta and listen to any podcast that he does . It is unbelievable him talking . In particular , there's a podcast that he did with James Smith on the James Smith podcast . It made me buy the book . I wanted to listen to more and read more about it , but he is a breathwork expert and they've actually got breathwork exercises in the end . But what I wanted to listen to more and read more about it . But he is a breathwork expert and they've actually got breathwork exercises in the end . But what I wanted to talk about was the brain associates relaxation with the long breath out .

Speaker 3 53:25

Right , and if we breathe in for , let's say , four seconds through the nose , just relax and breathe in . Put the hand on your stomach , because we've now taught ourselves to breathe up in the diaphragm and we don't actually drag the diaphragm down . So what we do is we breathe high in our chest . Another hint for a lot of people is , if you're breathing through your mouth , you're in a stress state , your body's in a stress state , so it's natural for us , as a footballer , to be running around or when we're in the gym , to be breathing through our mouth because we're in a sympathetic state , all right , so we're in a fight or flight state . But for us to be walking around in everyday life or sitting here like this , where it's not stressful at all , under no circumstances should we be breathing through our mouth .

Speaker 1 54:10

No , this is not stressful . Sitting behind the 3AW microphone not stressful at all , going out through three states .

Speaker 3 54:16

No , there's no stress at all .

Speaker 1 54:17

No stress related .

Speaker 3 54:18

No , none whatsoever . So , and we breathe in for four seconds and we breathe out . Now I highly recommend anybody that struggles with sleep when you climb into bed and put your phone away . When you climb into bed , lie on your back , put your hand on your navel , breathe down into the hand for four seconds and then breathe out for six through your nose . If you can get 10 cycles of that out , and while you're doing that you're focusing , breathing in and breathing out , not letting your mind think about anything else , just counting the breath , you'll be lucky . If you get through 10 cycles of that and you'll go to sleep because it is literally putting you in that nice parasympathetic state With no screen .

Speaker 1 55:00

No screen , no noise .

Speaker 3 55:03

Lights off and because you're focusing on the breath and counting , your brain can't think about anything else . So you're breathing 4 , 3 , 2 , 1 , and then 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5 , 6 . As you're breathing in and as you're breathing out , you're counting that . If your brain wanders , come back to counting the breath .

Speaker 1 55:21

That's a meditation no sheep , no counting of the sheep . Is that a thing of the past ?

Speaker 3 55:25

you can count . No , we'll see . Now there's an interesting observation . Do you know why we count sheep ?

Speaker 1 55:31

no , where's this going ? No , I didn't . No , no , but do you know ? No , it's not even a joke . The origins of it .

Speaker 3 55:34

Do you know why we can't shoot Well to ? Because while you're watching and counting sheep , you can't be thinking about Anything else the bills or anything else .

Speaker 1 55:41

Very good point , g'day , tony , mack and Roger , without having the internet back in at school and or at home . Yeah , it was a different world , wasn't it ? Like you said , british Bulldog Elastics yeah , elastics in the playground the girls playing elastics . Like you went to your school in the eastern suburbs with me in the western suburbs . Help that make sense .

Speaker 3 56:05

It absolutely does . It was just hand-downs , wasn't it ? Yeah , it was just evolution through the ages , like the year six would be playing it and the year fours and fives would be watching 133693, .

Speaker 1 56:17

come and join us . We've got plenty of room on the board . You'll get through Another couple of games . There's Tunnel Ball . Remember Tunnel Ball ? I do Tunnel .

Speaker 3 56:23

Ball yeah .

Speaker 1 56:24

Tunnel Ball and Captain Ball . Oh , what was Captain Ball ? I don't know . Somebody will have to remind us . So we know what Tunnel Ball was . In fact , I think that was . Wasn't that a game ? So you'd put the big ball right through everybody's leg for a team of 10 or 12 ?

Speaker 3 56:43

And then you'd have to go from the back run up to the front .

Speaker 1 56:45

And up to the front and do it all over again .

Speaker 3 56:46

Great game , very healthy game , athletic game .

Speaker 1 56:49

But what was Captain Ball ?

Speaker 3 56:51

I don't know . Cocky Laura 1 was a chasing game similar to Bull Rush . There's another one . I don't even know what Bull Rush was . No , Bull Rush Show my age now .

Speaker 1 57:00

Yeah , well done you . Let's take a couple of calls 1-double-3-6-9-3 . So breathing in All together now . Is this good for radio Breathing out through the nose ? It's good for everyone .

Speaker 3 57:13

Stop scrolling . I actually put one on my Instagram to make people stop scrolling . Just stop and breathe . On your Instagram , which is called , it's at a underscore healthy underscore shift . Well played , Tony .

Speaker 1 57:27

Thank you , just so people know . So they know how to contact when are we going . Let's go to Tony . Can we talk to Tony in Hamilton ? Hello Tony .

Speaker 8 57:36

How are you going ?

Speaker 1 57:36

Yeah , really well , say hello to the great man sitting the other side of the desk , roger .

Speaker 3 57:42

Hi Tony , how are you ?

Speaker 8 57:43

How are you going , Roger ? I'm very well , tony , how are you up there in Hamilton ? Yeah , not too bad . It's not too bad here in Hamilton . I'm in Warrnambool . I know Scott Stewart and Matthew Stewart from the Scott Stewart Staple Chase .

Speaker 1 57:59

Okay , right , okay , and just remind us who they are .

Speaker 8 58:02

Matthew works for 3YB and Matthew works for 3YB .

Speaker 1 58:05

There you go for the great radio station 3YB . It's been there a long time in Warrnambool .

Speaker 8 58:10

And Dave Drinkle in Hamilton , Kate , Tim and Joel . I know Joel .

Speaker 1 58:16

And they're all at 3HA in Hamilton , are they ?

Speaker 8 58:19

3HA in Hamilton . Yeah .

Speaker 1 58:20

And they do the brekkie program .

Speaker 8 58:23

Yeah , oh yeah , Kate Tim and Joel .

Speaker 1 58:25

Yeah , they're fantastic .

Speaker 8 58:26

They're good people .

Speaker 1 58:27

And they're going along beautifully .

Speaker 8 58:29

Yeah .

Speaker 1 58:29

Do you follow the football there in Hamilton Tone ?

Speaker 8 58:32

I haven't been going to the football but I would go for the Kangaroos , Not the Imperials . I used to . Imperials are a good team . Yeah , they're really good those Imps . They were a great team . They used to be a good team .

Speaker 1 58:44

Oh , yeah , mark Jackson , and yeah , I met Mark Jackson at the George Hotel one time , and I know Shane Loveless- oh yes , some great names there from all those wonderful teams Mark .

Speaker 8 59:02

Jackson and Shane Loveless and Peter Dacos . I was kicked with Tony Shaw when . I was a little fella with Eddie McGuire .

Speaker 1 59:12

Oh , the great Tony Shaw , part of 3AW . Tony , thank you , it's a great call . The great Tony Shaw part of 3AW , of course , tony , thank you , it's a great call If you would like to be part of it . 133693 . It's Australia Overnight , good morning . There's a great organisation called Media Stable who send out little storylines for people like this program to examine . Now , we can't get them in the middle of the night . But Joe Hart , an organisational psychologist and exec coach , who then is quoted as saying every time we face a challenge , roger , or want to reach a stretch goal , our default pattern of thinking , feeling and behaving tries to tell us that we're not good enough . And how many people go through life , including me , at some point , thinking that you're not good enough ? Or imposter syndrome ? Yeah , there , it is Imposter syndrome . And it goes on to say imposter syndrome kicks in and we think of a million excuses why we can't do it . Yeah , we do . How do you stop ?

Speaker 3 1:00:08

it .

Speaker 1 1:00:09

Well , we build evidence to confirm what we already know and this becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy . Sound familiar ? Yes , the best way to break the circuit , existing work pattern by doing something that fundamentally challenges number one , what we tell ourselves . Number two , how we see ourselves . And number three , subsequently , how we behave . And once we work this out , we can better understand how we see ourselves compared to how others see and experience us . It's the old expression if you could only see you through my eyes .

Speaker 3 1:00:43

Right Now . This is the thing I work a lot with clients around body image right and this is the classic that I can apply

Body Image and Sleep Techniques

Speaker 3 1:00:50

that into body image .

Speaker 1 1:00:52

For both male and female .

Speaker 3 1:00:53

Oh , very much . A lot of people don't realise that males suffer terribly from body image issues as well . And positive body image and negative body image are not opposites . Right , and I know you're going to go what and you're looking at me just like that . But negative body image is when you stand there and you say to your body my body's no good , Look how fat I am , look what's happened and I'm saggy here and you're pinching your body fat . Positive body image is not standing there , going oh my God , you are so hot , you look fantastic . It's actually about appreciating your body for what it does for you every single day . You've got two legs that you can walk on . You've got two arms . You can type , you can think , you can look , you can hug , you can kiss , you can smell .

Speaker 1 1:01:40

You can do all of those things that goes back in or feeds into you , like this notion and idea of being grateful for what you have .

Speaker 3 1:01:45

Well , I wanted to talk about the gratitude Hold that thought We'll come back to that in just a moment , because I I think that is an important point .

Speaker 1 1:01:51

It's very important Owen in Forest Hill .

Speaker 7 1:01:52

Good morning , good morning Tony and Roger Hi , I have a technique . Well , it's not my technique , but there is a technique called progressive muscle relaxation . Love it , it can help you get to sleep .

Speaker 3 1:02:04

The military sleep method .

Speaker 7 1:02:05

Any time of the day , yes , and you sort of , if you're lying there in bed , you just sort of tense up your left foot Yep , and then relax it , yep , and then work your way up to your left leg .

Speaker 9 1:02:18

Yep .

Speaker 7 1:02:18

Tense and relax , yep , all the way up to your side , then your left arm , and then up to the shoulders , and then round to the other shoulder , to the right , and then do that all the way down your body .

Speaker 3 1:02:31

Well done , owen . That's excellent . It's called a body scan meditation . And what you're actually doing and I'll tell you this , they teach the military this on the battlefield , right ? So what they do is they teach them so that they can put themselves to sleep within two minutes . And they do . They go to sleep within two minutes . So what they do is they literally focus on each individual part of the body , like , as you've said , like the foot , and the reason why we tense and release is because our brain then focuses on that . Then we tense and release the calf , and then we feel the knee , and then what you do is , after you've done that , it takes about 90 seconds then you lie there and you think , don't think , don't think and don't think . Oh , and where did you pick it up ?

Speaker 7 1:03:14

Just around the traps in various places .

Speaker 3 1:03:16

Yeah , it's excellent . It's really good . Yeah , it's called a body scan meditation and , if anybody's interested , if you were actually to Google the military sleep method , it explains exactly how that works and why it works . People can go to sleep on the battlefield with gunfire going over their head .

Speaker 1 1:03:34

They will do it , god forbid we ever have to do that . Oh yeah , I'd never want to be told that . What about in an aeroplane ? I reckon it'd be great for that too , wouldn't it ? Yep , very good .

Speaker 3 1:03:43

We have lost the art of so many things as humans because we're so stressed .

Speaker 7 1:03:50

Anything else you wanted to add before we let you go ? No , there is another technique getting to sleep , if you sort of picture like a wet beach , a sand , and you're there and you just with a stick do 99 in the sand and then you imagine the wave coming up and sort of washing that 99 away . Then you do a 98 . Yeah and a 97 . Do you know why that works ?

Speaker 3 1:04:14

It's like counting sheep , but yeah , Well , I explained like counting the sheep . This is why we count sheep and your visualization there of the numbers being washed off the sand . Your brain is focusing on that and it's not focusing on everyday life .

Speaker 1 1:04:29

And that's why we go to sleep . And it was Owen , you'll love this . Two years ago , during the Stop Smoking course , one of the things I did as part of the Stop Smoking course was imagining the whole packet being flung into sort of a river but a stream , if you like , and the ancillary items like lighter and acid , and actually floating away and leaving your life . Yep , yeah , and you visualise this idea of it . This whole thing , this whole routine of smoking , leaving your world . Yeah .

Speaker 1 1:04:58

And it was very powerful at the time . You know , prior to that , I would have said , well , that's bull tish . But , it's psychology . It works , but it works .

Speaker 3 1:05:04

Yeah , absolutely .

Speaker 1 1:05:06

Oh , and great call . Thank you for the reminder , kevin Sunshine , you are my sunshine . Good morning .

Speaker 13 1:05:12

Good morning Tony and good morning Roger .

Speaker 3 1:05:15

Morning Kevin . How are you ?

Speaker 13 1:05:17

All right , Look . In the wake of our most recent Anzac Day commemoration , I was wondering whether I might share a poetic tribute to a serviceman that never returned from World War I and the best-made horse that he left behind him .

Speaker 1 1:05:35

You're more than welcome to do that . Is it succinct ? Absolutely Good boy . And five , four , three , two standby relay stations five , 4 , 3 , 2 , 1 .

Speaker 13 1:05:50

Onalus . He comes when the gullies are wrapped in the gloaming and limelights , are trained on the tops of the gums to stand at the slip rails awaiting the homing of one who marched off to the beat of the drums . So handsome he looked in his putties and khaki , light-hearted he went like a youngster to play . But why comes he never to speak to his darky around the rails at the close of the day ? And why have the neighbours four , gathered so gently , their horses a-doze at the fence in a row ? And what are they talking of , softly , intently ? And why are the womenfolk lingering ? So One hand , soft and small , that so often caressed him , was trembling just now as it fondled his head . But what was the trickling warm drop that distressed him ? And what were those heartbroken words that she said ?

Speaker 13 1:06:47

Never brighter the paddocks that Bushmen remember , the green and the gold and the pink , have displayed , when spring weaves , a wreath for the brows of September , enrobed like a queen and a blush like a maid . The gums are a shoot and the wattles a cluster . The cattle are roaming , the range is astray , but why are they late with the hunt and the muster ? And why is the black horse , unsaddled , today , hard by at the station , the training commences In circles . They're schooling the hacks for the shows . The high-metalled hunters are sent at the fences , and satins and dapples , the brushes disclose . Sound-winded and fit and quite ready is Darkie , impatient to strip for the sprint and the flight . But what can be keeping his rider in khaki ? And why does the silence hang heavy tonight ? Ah , surely he'll come when the waiting is ended , to fly the stiff fences and take him in hand , blue-ribboned once more and three quarters extended , hard held for the cheers from the fence and the stand Still there on the crossbeam .

Speaker 13 1:07:54

the saddle hangs idle , the cobweb around the loose stirrup is spun , the rust on the spurs and the dust on the bridle and gathered mould on the badges he won .

Speaker 13 1:08:06

We'll take the old horse to the paddocks tomorrow where the grasses are weaving , breast high on the plain and there with the clean skins . We'll turn him in sorrow and must him never , ah never again . The bush bird will sing when the shadows are creeping , a sweet , plaintive note , soft , clear as a bell's . Oh would . It might ring where the bush boy is sleeping and colour his dreams by the far darting owls .

Speaker 1 1:08:34

Oh wow , Kevin , that's just amazing . Thank you so much for sharing it in what's been an amazing week . Of course , Anzac Day , Morning Rog . Can you name the name again , the author of the book Breathe ? The only one I can find is by James Nestor .

Speaker 3 1:08:48

That's right , James Nesta . It's exactly the book .

Speaker 1 1:08:50

That's the one , di , well done . When we come back we'll wrap it up with Roger , who's graciously stayed for an extra hour for us . We've got the quiz coming up the other side , top of the hour for the news , and then the Australia Overnight Quiz , which was fantastic . We had so much fun when we kicked that off a couple of weeks ago , a part of the program . We'll come back and talk about the idea , the notion , if you like , how important is , in our sense of wellbeing as a shift worker or anybody really the idea of gratitude and the distinctions and what they can mean for your world . 16 minutes away from two half an hour earlier in South Australia . Reading is the other thing too , to take a bit more time and do more reading , and that just gives you that quiet time to settle down and , by definition , becomes restful .

Speaker 3 1:09:35

Absolutely . Before we go to sleep , instead of scrolling mindlessly on our phones , pick up a book and read .

Speaker 1 1:09:42

We all do that . Best thing to understand things you like is reading . Thank you for this one . It says read autobiographies written about specific subjects in order to get insights of people who have had firsthand experience in certain things , not just theoretical teachings . Temple Grandin , autism , ron Davis , dyslexia and some interesting things that .

Speaker 1 1:10:02

Doris has been reading the idea of and I know you've read a bit about it the idea of gratitude and keeping a list and becoming just grateful . Just this heightened sense of gratitude that you bring to yourself , you bring to family , you bring to the world , it can be transformational . I know it sounds probably a little Happy clapper , happy clapper , but it really actually works Right Now .

Speaker 3 1:10:25

There's so much research behind this , tony , like lots and lots of research around a gratitude practice and journaling , and in fact , this was one of the key points that we talked about while I was away on the conference last week . This is in Queensland In Queensland Now the conference . Gratitude is well-researched because at the base of our brain we have what's called a reticular activating system . Our body sees so much every day and night and it can only let so many thoughts through , so that reticular activating system actually only lets through what it thinks we want to see . If you're a glass half empty type of person , that's literally what we see . If you are a glass half full type of person , you only see the good right .

Speaker 3 1:11:07

So , having a gratitude practice every night , three dot points just write down every night three dot points God , this bed's comfortable I'm so grateful for my bed right . Or I love coming home and shutting the front door in my safe house , right . And if you do that and you keep doing that , your body starts to look , or your mind starts to look , for the good that's happening in your life and it literally rewires your whole thought process of how you look and perceive life as well , because you can get bogged down in it if you wish , but it's certainly not the answer . Gratitude practice three dot points , three simple . I didn't have to walk far to get water this morning . How good is that ?

Speaker 1 1:11:50

You know just , I don't have to get , it always works , really , really

Appreciating the Small Things

Speaker 1 1:11:53

well , yeah , and you can become a little philosophical too about those things where you and I get up in the morning and we go to a tap and we get water . In other nations they may have to walk miles , k's just to get water . That might last them a few days , if they can find it , if they have access at all .

Speaker 3 1:12:12

You drove here in a car today . It started and you got to drive . It didn't let you down and you parked it and you walked in here today . Did you say thanks for that ? How many times do we get a flat tyre and then get out and think , oh , why does this always happen to me ? Seriously , but , we never get out and think , oh , why does this always happen to me ? Like seriously , yes , but we never get out of the car and go .

Speaker 1 1:12:31

That was a great drive . I love that . That was fantastic and thank goodness , I've got a car that has a spare tyre Well , that's right which I don't have . Well , many don't now . No , they don't . That's the problem .

Speaker 3 1:12:41

They don't even have . Mine doesn't even have a run flat .

Speaker 1 1:12:44

No you would have run flats .

Speaker 3 1:12:46

I've got run flats . I've got run flats on the car , but I don't have a thing . But what I'm saying is do we do that , Like when our children are sitting quietly watching TV ? Do we ever go up to the kids and say , geez , Johnny , you're being a good boy today ? No , we only ever tell them off oh , stop it . Shush , stop it , Don't do that , Don't touch that , Put that away . That's all we hear . But when they're being good , we never say to people geez , walk away from a night . I really appreciated that . Just a text message afterwards . How good was tonight .

Speaker 1 1:13:20

I have got into a habit in the last several years if you go out to a cafe or a restaurant , just to walk past where they may be making the coffee or even making the meal , and just talk to the chef or talk to the people behind the kitchen area , if you have access , just so I let you know . The steak tonight was amazing .

Speaker 3 1:13:36

I'll do that . I love it .

Speaker 1 1:13:37

The potatoes were great , or just by way of feedback . I'm not really doing it for them . I'm doing it because it actually it's just a lovely thing to do to make me feel good about the idea of being able to compliment . I'm healthy enough to give somebody a direct compliment .

Speaker 3 1:13:53

We are on the same page with this , because I actually recently had a really good experience , and I'm going to mention the store . It was Lululemon and I was upsold and upsold really well and the guy was fantastic . I walked into this store probably three or four months after my first contact and he remembered my name when I walked in . Now , I'm not a regular , but I walked in and David is his name and I remember that . I'm going to give him a plug , but I remember his name . And I walked in and I said , hi , david , how are you ? And he goes . Hi , roger , how are you .

Speaker 3 1:14:26

And I walked in and I said , hi , david , how are you ? And he goes . Hi , roger , how are you ? And my jaw would have smacked on the ground . I couldn't believe that he remembered my name . So what I did was I actually emailed Lululemon and I actually commented on that when I went into the store next time . The two staff members that served me , that really looked after me well that day both were so grateful for what they had , and so were management , management have contacted me and it's , I think , when you put a good work report in and you do things like that , I think it's and it's what you put out there . Yep is what you get back comes back to you . I totally agree with that .

Speaker 1 1:15:01

What you put out there comes back to you . You give that aura off and vice versa . Yeah , totally . Another couple of gems . Tunnel Ball we mentioned , I think . Did we find out what Cocky Laura ?

Speaker 3 1:15:14

was no .

Speaker 1 1:15:15

I tried Googling it , but it didn't come up , unless that's her signature , cocky Laura , I don't know . It's funny when you get some of these texts Chasing . A similar game to Bull Rush . Similar game to Bull Rush , similar game to Bull Rush . Okay , having recently met with my specialist , would be very interested to further discuss how our brains work . How do our brains work ? Do we know ?

Speaker 3 1:15:40

No , no , we don't . How can you remember things from 30 , 40 , 50 , 30 years ago ? We won't say 50 , but 30 years ago . Thank you , I can't remember what I did this morning .

Speaker 1 1:15:49

Yeah , exactly right , and that happens , I guess , as you get a bit older Alzheimer's people . Dad went through that . He didn't know what he had for dinner . But if you want to talk to him about you know what Mr Rolls and Mr Royce were trying to create as the Rolls-Royce brand going back 70 , 80 , 90 years .

Speaker 3 1:16:07

They tell you everything In detail . Dance of nuts and bolts In detail . Yeah , yeah , it was amazing .

Speaker 1 1:16:13

We've got to do this . We're back shortly . Fire text , roger . So a lot of people saying a great segment this morning . Well done , including some bits and pieces that came

Breathing Techniques Discussion With Tony

Speaker 1 1:16:22

through . Brandy was the other not . The drink was the other not . The drink was the other game that we used to play in the school yard Brandy .

Speaker 3 1:16:29

The wet tennis ball Wet tennis ball .

Speaker 1 1:16:30

That was the one , wasn't it . It used to sting Fastest game in the world . We won't mention that , but it was Pass the Parcel Yep , which was a bit of a party game from memory as a kid . But we won't get to all those texts , but thank you for all those people that bothered to text . We do love that .

Speaker 3 1:16:46

If you want to contact Roger , the best way to do that is through the website ahealthyshiftcom or at a underscore healthy underscore shift on both Instagram and TikTok , and the author is Tony Nesta N-E-S-T-O-R . Tony Nesta writes the book Breathe . Thank you for having me , tony .

Speaker 1 1:17:06

It's interesting . A lot of people have been inquiring about that , tony Nesta , the idea of breathing and that's a relatively new publication from memory .

Speaker 3 1:17:13

Yes , it is . But what I love is if you listen to the audio book , you actually get his colleague talking you through all the different breathing techniques as well , which is fantastic . It's written in the back of the book , but it's better to hear it from him , tony Nesta . Just listen to him on a few podcasts , because you can search Tony Nesta in podcasts and he will come up , but the one in particular is the one with James Smith . It's an excellent podcast . That's where I picked it up . I went and bought the book and I've got a hard copy and a listen Fantastic , thank you . We'll see you in a couple of weeks' time you betcha .