Intuitive Eating and Shift Work

Speaker 1 0:00

This is one of those key principles of intuitive eating is rejecting that mentality , that we feel like we need to change the size and shape of our body in order to be healthy , and so we start to look at health more holistically , so not just the size and shape of the body , but every aspect of our health the mental , the psychological , the spiritual , the social .

Speaker 2 0:24

Shift work can be brutal , but it doesn't have to be . Welcome to a healthy shift . My name is Roger Sutherland , certified Nutritionist , veteran Law Enforcement Officer and 24-7 Shift Worker for almost four decades . Through this podcast , I aim to educate shift workers using evidence-based methods to not only survive the rigors of shift work but thrive . My goal is to empower shift workers to improve their health and wellbeing so they have more energy to do the things they love . Enjoy today's show and welcome to another episode of a Healthy Shift podcast . It is with great pleasure that I get to welcome you to this show Now .

Speaker 2 1:09

If we rewind to the last episode of season one , which was episode number 51 , I had my colleague and friend , jeff Ash as a guest on the podcast . Now Jeff is well , he was just coaching in intuitive eating and working towards his certification in that , and Jeff is now a certified intuitive eating coach . Now , with this , he's done an awful lot of work around this area and mainly works with men , which is intuitive eating men , but also works with families . But Jeff being Jeff would literally take absolutely anyone on to teach them around intuitive eating . Now I highly recommend that people go back and listen to that episode first , episode number 51 . And the reason why I say that is because intuitive eating is literally not what you think . It's not just eating intuitively . There is a whole framework around intuitive eating , and you need to follow that framework to be in a position to actually become a proficient intuitive eater . And people like Jeff being certified are the people that you need in your corner to do that .

Speaker 2 2:25

Now I've been keeping tabs on Jeff and what Jeff's been up to over the last 12 months or so , and it's with great pleasure that I've actually got Jeff back on to the podcast , because I saw what he was up to and he's recently released something that I really want him to be on the show and talk all about . So , without much further ado , I would love for you to welcome my friend , jeff Ash , to this episode of the podcast . Welcome to the show , jeff Ash . How are you , jeff hey ?

Speaker 1 3:02

I'm good Thanks for having me on again .

Speaker 2 3:04

Oh my goodness me . Now we've got an exciting announcement to make here today and I'm just so humbled that you've come on . But this is gonna be some really good advertising for you onto my platform around this . So we're just gonna hold people in suspense here for a little while . Let's just give us a bit of background , because when I saw what you were doing , I just went oh my God , oh my God , for our shift working community , this is gonna be absolutely phenomenal to help them . I just know that it is .

Speaker 2 3:30

I've been having a look at things and , anyway , I'm not gonna give too much away . But , jeff , we've been friends for a long time and your podcast is one of my most listened to and I think you're an intuitive eating , a certified intuitive eating coach , and I think this is what pulls people in today , jeff , and because people want to learn more about this , because the diet culture it needs to die , doesn't it ? Because it's causing so many problems . Jeff , tell us a bit about yourself , tell us where you've come from , because you and I are the old guys of MNU , aren't we Like ? We sort of came in and pivoted late into the nutrition field and we're both very wired the same way , as far as we wanna read the research , we wanna understand , we want to help others , we wanna do all of that and we're sort of seen as the daddies of our group , I think , and we're both going off into completely different areas , which I think is really exciting . Jeff , tell us a little bit about your background and how you're journey into the intuitive eating side of coaching .

Speaker 1 4:28

Yeah , definitely . So my background's a little bit different too Well , definitely very different than yours . I've never worked shift work . I've stayed up late , you know it works long hours , but never the kind of work that shift workers are involved in . I typically had a fairly normal kind of work schedule . So my background is actually in software development and I've been a software developer for over 40 years . So I started when I was 11 . That gives you an idea how old I am . I'm 52 now . So when I was 11 , instead of playing video games , playing Atari , I got into programming and just loved it , and so since then that's been kind of my main day job

Transforming Mindsets

Speaker 1 5:12

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Speaker 1 5:12

But , as many of us do , we get interested in health and fitness and improving maybe certain aspects of our own health and fitness , and then we get into it and really enjoy the process and figure out that , hey , you know , this would be something that I think I could really enjoy helping other people do as well , to learn more about this . And so I decided to go into go get my personal training certification and then also , like you , I went through MNU , which is a phenomenal nutrition program , and got my nutritionist qualification through MNU and through that whole process . When I started I was very much in the typical fitness mindset , which was diet and exercise for the purpose of controlling your body weight , your body appearance , that kind of thing . So a lot of my focus early on was helping people to lose weight , helping people maybe they had aesthetic goals . You know I'd done my own kinds of body building type of phases never competed , but those were kind of the goals that I had for myself and so through that process that's kind of what got me really interested in it .

Speaker 1 6:17

But when I started MNU I got really interested in working with entire families because I thought you know , this would be really cool to bring mom and dad and the kids and work together with all of them to help them kind of get on the same page with each other and that would really help it to sink in for , you know , the parents and then also for that next generation , the kids going forward . And so while I was going through MNU I began to expand and learn , in addition to the MNU content from the work of Ellen Satter , who is kind of the OG of child nutrition , and got involved in that and learning about that . And that's where I got exposed to a weight neutral approach to health and nutrition , which doesn't involve intentionally trying to change the size and shape of your body , but it focuses on those habits of behaviors , mindsets , thinking in terms of your body as an instrument rather than an ornament , all that and those kinds of things . And so through that process I learned about her model , which is called eating competence , which I think is a really cool way of describing it , because you know , as we're kids , we start off as these novice eaters and then we kind of become a competent eater over time and we won't go into that one . But then that kind of led me into intuitive eating , also because there are a lot of similarities in her approach and the intuitive eating framework .

Speaker 1 7:38

And once I really dove into the intuitive eating framework I really liked how it's laid out in those 10 principles . They make so much sense . It's easy to connect with that engineering mind that I had , you know , the one that likes to develop software . It just resonated with me and so I just went down that path and got my qualification under . Evelyn Tribbley , who's one of the co-founders of that framework and author of the book , did my supervision directly under her . So that was an amazing experience there .

Speaker 1 8:08

And since taking that new approach and having coached people in that intentional weight loss and the frustrations that they had , this really presented kind of the answer for many of those people who are struggling with their relationship with food , body image , those kinds of things . And so really over the last few years I haven't looked back . So that's kind of where I'm at with that now and now I even shifted my focus even more so to working with men over the last couple of years , specifically because most of the voices and the content came from a female perspective , which is great , but it was often targeted at women , blatantly targeted at women , to the exclusion of men . And then other times it just wasn't intentionally excluded , but I saw that it was kind of underserved but that a lot of us men could really benefit from changing that mindset and that approach to our health , and so that's been a really exciting thing to see a lot of men opening up to that idea and taking it on board .

Speaker 2 9:10

That is unbelievable , jeff . Now , as men , we are all big chest beaters and we are too tough and too good for this , and we know that we need to suck on protein shakes while we're walking around gym in a string of singlet . And this is literally the perception that a lot of people have , because what we forget is men , just like women , suffer severely from body image issues as well , don't they ?

Speaker 1 10:28

Oh yeah , absolutely . I used to work a lot with women at first because I kind of worked with anybody who wanted to work with me and it tended to be women . And I find that , while there's different driving factors between with men and women , that they often end up in the same place with that dissatisfaction with their body , the body image concerns , the self-hatred in many cases , the disgust , the frustration in losing , gaining , losing , gaining weight and that diet roller coaster . And what's interesting is , a lot of times when we dig down to the underlying root cause of a lot of it , it's often the same kind of thing the Clean your Plate Club thing , the parental interference , all kinds of things like that being on and off diets .

Speaker 2 11:12

I think that is really , really important . I think a lot of not think , I know , and you'll support this as well , and so does the research , because when we really look back into it diet culture there's so many factors . Oh no , I actually did this on my walk and talked this morning . I talked about it's not simply . I mean , the science is calories in , calories out , end of story . When a person wants to lose weight , there's no argument with that , but you can't just tell a person that they need to eat less and move more , because it's so complicated and there's so many ingrained psychological barriers that are not helping people . One of them that you literally just mentioned is from the time they were kids . You have to clear your plate . Now I've heard you say before on podcasts that you weren't one of those people . You were lucky , but I was and I struggled to leave food on my plate Full stop , and I do . I really struggle with it because I feel it is wasting , but now I've got a really good handle on it .

Speaker 2 12:08

Jeff , you are the one that introduced me to intuitive eating , and it was when you introduced me to it and I looked at the principles and I started researching and I started learning more and more about it .

Speaker 2 12:19

This is why I now coach clients in this style of coaching . I'm going to say ran nutrition , but it's a health and well-being approach full stop , because it's completely changing a person's mindset around it . It lets them look at their past dieting and see how it hasn't worked for them . It lets them value their bodies for what it is , and a lot of people really poo poo intuitive eating , and the reason why they do that is because they don't understand what intuitive eating is , and I've listened to podcasts with you talking about each of the principles . I've heard you on the podcast with Shannon Beard discussing it as well , and Shannon was my mentor for six months , so I went right down this line with Shannon as well , so the three of us are severely on the same page fighting this battle at the moment . Can you do us a favor ? If you would , would you explain to people what intuitive eating actually is ?

Understanding Intuitive Eating Principles

Speaker 1 13:12

Yeah , definitely , and I'm so glad that you brought that up because , yeah , it is misunderstood in so many cases . Now some people understand it and still poo poo on it . That's you know , that's fine . But the worst is when they mischaracterize it and I was guilty of that myself too , because we have this word intuitive and eating and we tend to apply this sort of well , I know what the word intuitive means and eating , and so then we take kind of our own definition of it and apply it and say , well , that's nonsense , or that's what got me in the mess I'm in to begin with , and you know that kind of a thing .

Speaker 1 13:47

But in reality the intuitive eating framework that we're talking about here , when we're talking about it kind of in that capital I , capital E way , is 10 specific principles that each build on one another and they all work together . And so sometimes people will poo poo on it because they hear you know one of the principles , which is make peace with food . And in that principle then we have this idea of unconditional permission to eat , and this is where you give yourself unconditional permission to eat any food , in any amount , at any time , as often as you want , no restrictions on that , and so immediately people will hear well , that's other nonsense . Who can do that ? If I just give myself permission to eat anything I want , I'm just going to eat pizza and burgers and candy all the time . But when you really stop and think about it , that's probably not the case . I mean , giving yourself unconditional permission to eat just means that you're not going to restrict yourself from those things . But in reality we know that eating those kinds of things all the time we're not going to feel particularly great . And so that principle by itself , again it requires those other nine principles for it to really make sense in a person's life . And so that's , that's one of of the principles there .

Speaker 1 15:07

And where the principles really start off is rejecting the diet mentality , and so that's exactly what we were talking about there .

Speaker 1 15:14

That's getting away from that view of the body being an ornament or something that we need to change , to change the appearance of it , the size or the shape , in order to make us worthy or to fit in , and that kind of a thing . And so we know that most diets tend to work in the short term , but then over time , almost everyone regains that weight over time , whatever the percentage is . You'll hear 95% , 80% , 85 , whatever the number is . I don't know the exact number because research conflicts a lot on those things , but whatever it is , we know the vast majority of people end up regaining that weight , and that's why companies like WW and Noom are starting to sell the weight loss injections and those kinds of things , because they know that people are having difficult time maintaining what they end up losing .

Speaker 1 16:05

And so this is one of those key principles of intuitive eating is rejecting that mentality that we feel like we need to change the size and shape of our body in order to be healthy , and so we start to look at health more holistically , so not just the size and shape of the body , but every aspect of our health the mental , psychological , the spiritual , the social , financial , you know all of those kinds of things .

Speaker 2 16:28

Fantastic . Now I think this is the first principle that started off , and we've got the whole episode there that you and I did around intuitive eating and I highly encourage anybody that hasn't listened to it to go back and listen to it . We're not actually here to talk about you know what intuitive eating is . Today We've got a little exciting announcement it's not a little , it's huge actually and I want to talk about that . But I encourage people to go back and have a look at that episode , have a listen to that episode around intuitive eating , what it is covering , the 10 principles . We talk all about the benefit of it for shift workers because you know we're looking at an old lead into this is intuitive eating works . There is no doubt about it . It absolutely works , and I have testimonials all over my website from shift working nurses , train drivers , police paramedics that I've taken through it .

Speaker 2 17:22

Now , I'm not a certified intuitive eating coach and I don't even profess to be , and I make it very clear that I'm not but I do understand , through my own mentorship from Sheninbi , the principles around it and how to work with people . It's literally not about calories and macros , although the bottom line is , science tells you that that's what it is . But we have to let go of that , because there's so many psychological barriers that occur and everybody that wants to lose weight today , one of the first things they do is they start eliminating food groups , whether it be carbohydrates I can't have sugar . I'm going to cut sugar out of my diet . I can't have dairy I'm going to cut dairy . I'm going to go carnivore , I'm going to go vegan , I'm going to go vegetarian . And this creates untold confusion in people's lives .

Speaker 2 18:07

And one of the biggest problems that we have now is we have these tracking apps like macros . First , we have my fitness pal . We have all of those type of tracking apps . To be evidence based , it would be hard for me to say that they actually create a lot of disordered behavior , but you know they do actually create a lot of disorder because they've become very obsessive and people get to the stage where , oh , I can't do this , it's all just far too hard . But , jeff , here we are . We've arrived at your time to shine , because you have a really exciting announcement to make , and this is the purpose of this podcast today . I really , really want you to announce this here now and tell us all about what it is you've been working on and what you've done .

Speaker 1 18:48

Yeah , absolutely Thanks , and you know it's interesting . You mentioned evidence based and with these apps because the evidence there is some evidence that supports

Developing the Non Diet Companion App

Speaker 1 18:57

the fact that apps like my fitness pal and these tracking apps actually contribute to some disordered attitudes , mindsets and behaviors around food , because they tend to encourage that obsessive mindset around food and the specifics of what we eat and how much I can get , picking and picking apart our meals and being unable to just eat without having to look at the app and say , well , how many calories do I have left ? I need to know how much protein I have left for the day , and that kind of thing . So that's actually an evidence based approach to say that there are some potential problems with these apps . And that does kind of lead us into this project that I've been working on myself .

Speaker 1 19:40

As I mentioned earlier , I've been developing software for over 40 years , and so I decided that why not take my love of software development because I really do love that and my love of coaching and working with people and helping them to build a better relationship with food and their body ? Why not combine those two together and create an app that people can use for helping them along their non diet and intuitive eating journey , and so I've created a brand new app called the non diet companion , and it's available on iOS and Android so everybody can use it . It's even available on a web based version , so if you prefer not to use your phone for that kind of thing , you can still access the entire full app via a normal web browser . Now , this app is really cool because it allows you to track , in one sense , but it's really more of a journal . So basically , the focus , kind of the key concept underlying this , the non diet approach is shifting our thinking about our bodies being an ornament , you know , to this mindset of where it's thought of as more of an instrument , and so this app is designed to help people to step off that diet roller coaster really once and for all and leave behind those calorie and macro and and point tracking apps and you know where diets have really trained us to disconnect from and suppress our body's natural appetite regulation cues and how we're feeling , and to tell us when to eat and how much to eat and when to stop , regardless of , you know , what we may have been involved in in that day that may require more or less energy .

Speaker 1 21:22

The non-diet companion app is going to assist people in really re-establishing that connection with , and trust in , their body . You know really as it should be , and so it's exciting to see this out there . There's nothing else out there that it has all of this in the app , and it involved months of design and development with the purpose of providing that support and direction for people that are embracing this and really help them in all facets of their health . And one of my goals too with it was really to make it available to everybody Because , as you know , nothing beats one-on-one coaching with someone like yourself , who somebody can go to and really dig down deep and unpack issues and share areas where they're feeling successful and areas where they may be struggling , and that kind of a thing . Nothing beats that human interaction . But not everybody has the financial means or the time to do that , and so I think this app is going to be great to both support people who do have that one-on-one connection with a coach , but also those who maybe don't have the means for something like that .

Speaker 2 22:30

That is absolutely fantastic , and congratulations , jeff , for getting that out there . Obviously , I've known you , for what is it , jesus ? It's five years now . Like that's crazy , isn't it ? But I've known you for five years and you were always like one of the mentors in our Mac Nutrition Uni mentoring lab , helping people with things , and it's been amazing to watch your journey and I must admit , I've watched it with a lot of interest , with your going into the intuitive eating , and here you are now using your .

Speaker 2 22:59

We just are so parallel . You're using your software development side to bring something to the people as far as intuitive eating goes , so you've developed an app , whereas I can use 39 years of shift work experience with a qualification in nutrition to actually help shift workers do that . But I think you've actually nailed a really , really important piece here that I can use in my coaching , and I would be . You know , I'm going to be thrilled to be actually using that , because I've had a look at it , and what I would like you to explain to us is , though , is we know that there's evidence now that actually says that , like tracking on my fitness pal , is very disordered . So why is the non diet companion or the app , whether it be software , web based , or whether it be an app . How is this different other than we've got to put this in and we've got to put that in ? How is it not going to become disordered ?

Speaker 1 23:55

as far as tracking goes , yeah , it's a really good question , and that's something that I've been very conscious of from the beginning , because I did not want to create yet something else to become obsessed with or to waste your time doing , and so it could become very problematic . So , from the beginning , the language that's used in the app and all of the features are designed for somebody who's trying to get away from that way of thinking and some of those obsessive tendencies , and it's really designed to help people better connect with their body , not disconnect and distract and that kind of a thing . So it's really designed to be a journal that you have with you at all times , and so we know how important journaling can be in the process of mental health therapy and treatment , as well as in working on our relationship with food , and so we're always encouraging people to reflect and journal and work on mindfulness and stuff , and so that's really the core of what the app is all about . But the journal with only blank pages might not really be as helpful as one that provides various journaling prompts and stuff like that , and so the app has a number of built-in journals , and they'll probably be more to come on a regular basis , but these journals help you as you reflect and process things that are going on in your life , around your relationship with food and your body and your health .

Speaker 1 25:18

So some examples of some of the journals in there I'll just kind of outline a couple of them here . Like , there was a journal called , and they're categorized too under movement , nourishment , mindfulness habits and just kind of general , so things where they don't really fit into any of those categories . But one example is body awareness during movement and exercise . So that's one of the journals and it's got five or six different prompts and the couple of those prompts are things like how did you listen to your body's cues during movement today ? What did you learn from this experience ? And so this is something you could journal every day for a period of time .

Speaker 1 25:54

And one of the cool things too , before I go any further , is you can enable and disable these different journals , so you aren't going to be overwhelmed . So if there's , you know , a dozen different journals available to you , you don't have to have them all in your face all the time . You can pick the ones that you want to have out there and available to you to keep your attention focused on , and then you can disable them . You don't lose any of your data it's still all there and then enable different apps . Maybe you're working on your relationship with your body and movement for a time , so you can enable those . Maybe now you want to switch over and really focus some attention on hunger and fullness , and so you might enable those .

Speaker 1 26:30

But another example from that body awareness journal , another prompt , is reflect on how your body felt before , during and after exercise today . How did you honor its cues and adjust your movement accordingly ? So , as you can see , the questions are they're not like super , super deep , but they'll prompt you to give you some thoughts like , huh , now I hadn't really thought of that . And then now you can type it in on your phone or on your computer and then now you have a record of that and you can go back through at different times and kind of review those , those different things . And instead of looking at progress based on changes in your scale and stuff , you can go back through and look at , hey , what was my mindset back six months ago ? What were the kinds of things that I was writing in my journal six months ago ? And then where am I at today ? And then now you can see that , that incredible progress that you made . Wow , I was almost a completely different person in the way that I thought about nutrition and my body back then , and so that's that's kind of what the gist of the core features of the app .

Speaker 1 27:32

It's around this journaling concept , and so then you know like there's another journal called the mindful nourishment , and in that one you have a prompt that says reflect on the meal that you prepared and ate today how did you choose ingredients mindfully to nourish your body ? And so there's some things there where you can just answer them real shortly and quickly . And one of the cool things , too , is that you can connect with your practitioner . So someone like you , roger , can connect with your clients through the app and they can share any of their journal entries that they want to with you . Now the cool thing for the users is that your coach does not own your data . You own your data . So if you you know if you move on to a different coach or stop working with them , you still have your data because it's in your your app . But because you can connect with your coach , then you can share that data with them . So it's a really cool feature .

Speaker 1 28:25

And so then one of the other things . That's really nice is there's this home feed where I have some daily content , just a few pieces of content there that will help you on this journey so you're not overwhelmed . You know , when you go looking for content on a daily basis on Instagram , it's really easy to get sucked in and you're , you know , spend hours there or you're just bombarded with ads or garbage stuff from influencers or cat videos or you know , whatever pops up and maybe you want to just focus on some , some of these things to work on , and so those are on that home feed . But also on that home feed there's a daily prompt in the reflection where you can it's just kind of a general prompt to ask a real quick question , you know , shift the focus to body functionality how did your body support and enable your daily life ? So you could quickly add a journal entry there for that . Different things like that , and so that's some of the stuff there .

Speaker 2 29:17

Jeff , I just got excited when you talk about that , because I want people that are listening to this right now . There's a number of things that I want them to take note of , and I just want to back over a few of the things that you've actually just said there , jeff , and number one is reflection and journaling . Now we know , as evidence-based practitioners , we know , that journaling is supported by science . We know that , and I also know , and so do you through working with clients , getting them to stop and just ask themselves a simple question before they eat or before they prepare food can literally be life-changing for them , because we go through a very busy life now and I'm going to go back to shift workers here , geoff , so let me just bear with me on this , because we're targeting the shift worker , but shift workers are running highly stressed jobs and they're doing overtime .

Speaker 2 30:11

They're very short staff . They're very heavy on what they have to do at work . They come home , they just don't have time to do this . They're organizing kids , organizing husbands or organizing wives , organizing the house , paying the bills . It's a very , very stressful life To be sitting there and trying to , and then what happens is we then either get our Uber Eats , or we quickly throw together something for the kids and ourselves and we scoff it down , we eat it and then we move on , and then , before we know it , in 12 months time or two years time , we turn around and we've put on about 10 kilos in weight and we can't work it out .

Speaker 2 30:46

But the bottom line is what we've actually done is we've lost connection with our own body , and that is

Intuitive Eating and Workout Tracking App

Speaker 2 30:53

literally what my coaching now works with the shift workers to get them to stop for 30 seconds and ask themselves the question what do I feel like , what is going to nurture my body and fuel my body , and how much of it do I actually want ? Because by stopping and asking yourself those questions , we're not doing it subconsciously and by rote , are we ? And I think this is the most important thing . Now , this is where people might look at this and go oh no , that's just too much work to journal . You know what , if that's too much work for you , you're the one that actually needs it , right ?

Speaker 1 31:33

And there's lots of different ways that you can do this , and so you know there's so many things . I'm not a journal or myself I don't really journal . The way I work things out is I talk out loud to myself while I'm in the car , I have conversations , I'll think of ways to explain a particular concept . I'm almost having a debate or a discussion with somebody else and kind of walking through playing both sides of that . How would I respond in this particular case ? And for me , that's a way that works well for me , but for a lot of people that journaling is a way to do it . But there are other things that I do keep track of and I use the app for that too , and so there's lots of different ways that people can incorporate these different principles and some of the features of this app , regardless of whether they're a journal or not .

Speaker 1 32:23

And so you know some people like for me , example , I like to have a pretty structured workout program and I like to see progress , and a structured workout program is a good way to objectively recognize progress over time . So you know you were lifting with 35-pound dumbbells on this exercise this week . Six months from now you're up to 50s . And you know now you're up to 60s and so forth . So you can see that progress and I like to be able to see that .

Speaker 1 32:50

And so another thing that I've incorporated in the app is around the movement part and detailed workout tracking . So the detailed workout tracking is not something that's typically part of intuitive eating , because the emphasis is often on just movement , joyful movement , and just moving your body in ways that make you feel good . But one of the things I like to encourage people to do is that if you like to have structure with your workouts , if it's not an obsession , if it's not a disorder , kind of a mindset where you can't take a day off or where you've got to get into workouts a day or else you feel bad about yourself , that's a whole different issue . The journaling would probably help you there , but for a lot of us , the physical activity is not really a negative aspect of our relationship with our body and we like to track those things , and so there's a detailed workout tracker in there where you can track your reps and your sets and your drop sets and all of that .

Speaker 1 33:47

It has all of your exercises and one of the cool things I put into the app that is mind blowing and so cool . It's just super exciting . We probably all are familiar with a lot of this advanced AI that's out there now , and what I managed to do with the app is that I managed to incorporate it with the chat GPT engine and so you can describe a workout program that you would . Let's say , you went to a personal trainer and you wanted to describe to them your ideal workout program , all of your limitations , your challenges , kind of how many days a week you have , what kinds of exercise equipment you like to use machines , barbells , dumbbells- vans GMO home .

Speaker 2 34:31

You know whether it's GMO home ?

Speaker 1 34:32

yeah , yeah , and then you explain to the app and play in English what you're looking for . It builds you a complete workout program matching those specifications , with all your exercises , sets , reps and everything laid out for you . And so for the intermediate or advanced lifter , they probably wouldn't want to do that . So of course , you're going to build your own workout . So it allows you to put your own workout programs in there . But for those that are novices we're brand new to this it's so frustrating when people would say , hey , do you have any suggestions for good beginner workout programs ? Are there any good ones out there ? And it's like , well , I could send you to this guy . He's got really good workout programs but he's going to talk a lot about losing weight and about these workouts and how they're going to help you lose weight , and when I have some of you struggling in that area , I don't want to send them there .

Speaker 2 35:18

It's canter intuitive , isn't it Totally canter intuitive ? Yeah ?

Speaker 1 35:22

Or when somebody says , hey , do you have any suggestions for beginner workout program ? And you just say , well , yeah , why don't you Google it ? You'll find something . It's like , yeah , but you never know what influencer you're going to come across that's so true and the messaging that you're going to get . So this app allows you to avoid all of that stuff and it's taking the entire knowledge of the internet and building you that workout program .

Speaker 1 35:46

It's amazing the quality of the programs that it actually puts together for you and you can experiment with it . And so , as an example , you can type in something like a beginner workout program to help build strength and stamina , have a membership to Planet

AI-Generated Workout Programs and Autonomy

Speaker 1 35:58

Fitness . That's a popular low cost gym in the US , and so the internet knows GPT knows all the equipment that's available at Planet Fitnesses . And then so you go on and you say and I prefer to use machines , but would like to maybe learn some dumbbell exercises too . I have bad knees and have difficulty getting up and down from the floor , so it'd be great to avoid the exercises that require getting on the floor and I have a bad back , whatever . So you enter it in , explain it just like I did there , and it builds a program from that for you , that is absolutely unbelievable .

Speaker 2 36:31

Where are we going , Jeff ? Like it's scary , isn't it ? But don't get me wrong here , though , but I just absolutely , you know , it just blows my mind Like I stand here with my hands on my head like because I can start to think of so many other ways that that could be used and how you could use it . You're a qualified PT and you would be writing programs for clients . You know you would have been doing that . Do you give it credibility with the programs that it's writing ?

Speaker 1 36:57

Yeah , they're legit . I mean , there's things where I look at it and I'm like I probably would have picked a different exercise , but it's not a bad choice . Another trainer probably would pick that one . You know like it might put more heavy on the quads and a lower body day than I might typically do . But again , each individual who I work with I tend to program it differently anyway , and so what you get from the AI generated thing is pretty astonishing , and the app's only $6.99 a month , and so it is .

Speaker 1 37:29

When you think about that and what you'd have to pay for a trainer to develop a program for you and coach you , and that kind of a thing , it really is like I said , nothing beats working one-on-one with a qualified coach I mean hands down . But when you don't have those means available at the time again , money whatever this can be just such a great option . And often too , if you're working with someone who is naughty , you may be working with a nutritionist who's not a qualified PT , so they can't write a program for you . So now this gives you the opportunity to kind of build that , get started on the right foot and kind of get moving , and then , if you decide you want to take it up a notch and the quality or the level of training , then you can go look for a , you know , look for a human coach .

Speaker 2 38:15

Do you know what ? I can't tell you how much I love that component of it , and I'll tell you why . Because I'm thinking of the psychological side of this , because that's the way my mind works . The way I see it is , if I've got a client that is running this app right , the running non-diet companion app and I'm tapped into that so I can see what they're doing , there's nothing to stop them from just because what we want to do is we want to get clients just moving , don't we ? We want them to take ownership of it , because what we really want to do , more than anything else , is have them feel like they're in control . They're the one that are steering the ship and all we're doing is guiding them in the right way or not .

Speaker 2 38:56

If someone's in a position where they could say I want to grow my glutes and I'm going to membership to this gym , what exercises should I do ? But I've only got three days a week and I've only got 30 minutes , it's going to write a program for them and I don't need to know about that , because they've taken ownership . They're the ones that are going to go into the gym . They've had this program written for them where they don't have to have hands on with anybody no PT , no coach , no nothing . They can literally just go in and play and learn themselves and just go through it and just learn and do those exercises . I just think because once they've got the exercise , then they can just Google how do I do a barbell hip thrust for argument sake , and then they can learn . So you would look at your program . The good thing about AI is as well is , if you look at the program and you don't like that , do that again and it will just rewrite a whole program for you .

Speaker 1 39:52

It gives you a different one every time you ask for it . You can use the exact same wording and you'll get something different each time . It's really cool .

Speaker 2 39:58

Now this here , jeff . I think this is an absolute clincher for people , because I love to get people moving . I mean , having 10,000 step count is well . Personally , I think it's disordered . I don't think it's necessary . I just think that people need to take themselves for a walk and feel their body moving and be blessed that they can actually walk and do that and just feel it and just enjoy it and be present in what they're doing . Now you might think that's happy clapper , but by golly that's what works and that's what gets people working .

Speaker 2 40:27

I've had a client that has literally wouldn't walk . I got them walking . They started enjoying it more . We didn't put a distance on it , we put a time on it . They then walk that much and then they'd come around the block but the podcast hasn't finished so they'd go around again . Now they're training for a half marathon and they're going to run a half marathon . Now that's the power of someone owning it themselves and just starting to get moving and gaining momentum .

Speaker 2 40:53

I think someone who has been able to write their own program through telling it what they actually want and what they want to do . I want bigger shoulders . We all know that everyone's going to put in there . I want to lose my belly fat . We all know that , and , fair enough , that's their right to do that . But they've got to understand the patience is required , and that's another thing . But anyway , going back to the app , I think this is an absolute game changer , because people can be quite secret it's part of that and they can take ownership of it and just go into the gym , because nothing is better than walking into the gym with purpose . Is there ? I've got a program . I'm walking in . This is the machine , exactly .

Speaker 1 41:33

That autonomy is such a big part of it and that's why it's so cool to be able to do it yourself and also to choose how you want to approach it . If you work with a coach , most coaches are going to I don't , because I work for this non-diet perspective but most coaches , most PT's , are going to want you to track the details of your workout and they're going to want you to give it to them each week so they can check it and they're going to want to know . That's fine , that's cool , that's great for making progress , but not everybody cares about that . Some people just want to play , some people want to just move in different ways from time to time . One of the other things , as I pointed out with the app you can use it in a way that suits you the best . There is this detailed thing Tracks all your sets , reps , rest times , drop sets , supersets , all that kind of thing . You can do all the fancy stuff , but then there's you can also track when you go to track a workout . You can track it with the details or you can track it with a simple approach where it pulls up your workout , your sets and reps that the workout has described for you , but you don't have a way to mark them off or check them off . If you want to do two sets and it said to do three sets of six to eight and you do two sets of 10 to 15 , that's your business . You shouldn't feel bad about it . This helps to take that pressure off of you , too , because it lays out here's what the recommendation is for today's workout . But then at the bottom , instead of writing all the details of each set and rep , it says as you begin your workout , try to stay connected with your body physically , emotionally and psychologically .

Speaker 1 43:11

When you're finished , reflect for a moment and record your thoughts and feelings about your workout today . What did you enjoy about it ? What didn't you like ? Were there any movements that made you proud or motivated ? What would you like to try or focus on in future workouts ? Did you accomplish anything new ? Is this something you'd like to continue doing ? That's another way , that's another option in the app to track your workouts . You can go back and forth and track from day to day how you want to . You can use those more generalized journals that I talked about earlier . You can use this workout tracking journal to track the details or to track in a much more reflective , thoughtful way , where you're not so concerned with whether you did all the prescribed things . There's just lots of different ways that you can do that . That's one of the things that I really like about intuitive eating is that it's an approach that allows each individual to take ownership of their own health journey , whether that involves doing those detailed things or not . It's really cool .

Speaker 1 44:13

The hunger and fullness that we talked about earlier is another really cool feature in the app . That's something that I think a lot of people will absolutely love . With that hunger and fullness feature , there's a hunger and fullness scale that you can go in and you can track your hunger and fullness levels . A lot of people will do that for a period of time because it can be helpful to sit at either one meal a day or even every meal , whatever suits you with where you are . You can go in and you can use this as a nice little exercise to check in with your hunger . The app allows you to do . You can log for a particular meal . So breakfast , lunch , dinner , snack that's all customizable . You can call them whatever you want supper , dinner , tea , all of those things or you can just say it was an observation that's one of the important things too is that we don't necessarily need to use the hunger and fullness scale just around meals . We can just use it throughout the day and say you know , have a couple of minutes , I'm going to try and really check in with my body and see where's my hunger level right now .

Speaker 1 45:20

It's got a couple of cool little sliders . You start your hunger and fullness at the beginning , hunger and fullness at the end . If it was a meal . Slide the thing over . It tells you ravenous to eat , irritable and anxious , very hungry , looking forward to a good-sized meal , and so forth . A nice little description . So you know what a three is and a seven and that kind of a thing . There's cool little reflections to go along with it too . That again , you can optionally log whatever you want about that meal . Whatever is interesting . The hunger type that you experienced was a physical , emotional , taste , practical . Did you honor your hunger ? What did you eat ? Were there any cues or cravings , physical sensations , and then the prompts go a little more in depth on that , on each one of those , but other things that it helps you to reflect on during that eating experience . So lots of cool things there .

Speaker 2 46:18

I hope you're enjoying the show . If you are , please don't forget to rate and review once you've finished . This helps the shows reach enormously . And have you got my free e-book the Best Way to Eat on Night Shift ? Well , this is a comprehensive guide to the overnight fast , why we should fast and how to best go about it . I've even included a few recipes to help you . I've put a link to the e-book in the show notes .

Speaker 2 46:44

And are you really struggling with shift work and feel like you're just crawling from one shift to the next ? Well , I've got you . If you would like to work with me , I can coach you to thrive , not just survive , while undertaking the rigors of 24 , seven shift work . I also conduct in-house live health and wellbeing seminars where I will come to your workplace and deliver evidence based information to help your wellbeing team to reduce unplanned leave and increase productivity in your workplace . I've put the links in the show notes to everything mentioned . You can find me at ahealthyshiftcom or on Instagram at a underscore healthy , underscore shift .

Speaker 2 47:29

Now let's get back to the show . And I think sometimes you know , like you've said , to have the hunger and fullness scale and you're standing there and you think I think I'm a bit hungry . And then you look at it and you ask yourself and I'm just going to have a big drink of water . And you have a big drink of water and it actually curbs that and you can go oh okay , so it wasn't actually hunger , I actually feel all right , or I'm not quite there yet , but all you know , I can see myself getting there , so you can start to think about that as well . That's incredible . I really , really like that .

Speaker 2 48:06

Now I just want to ask you this , because you know you're talking about all these features and you are the software developer , right , so you've got to handle on everything . You know all the cogs and wheels and everything in the background . You know how it all works , it's all in your mind . But for the end user , for the person that picks it up and starts looking at it , is it really convoluted and complicated , like let's think of a person

Simplifying Tracking and Diet Culture

Speaker 2 48:26

that's like someone with ADHD , that has trouble . You know , focusing on that , how easy is it to set up and start using ? I love the way . I loved the way that you said before that you can turn particular journals on and off , and I think that's really important , because otherwise someone gets totally overwhelmed and they think look , I might as well be tracking , because I'm sitting here for half an hour of your day writing everything in , whereas they could start to lay it as habits until it becomes formulated in their own mind how clunky is it ? To actually clunky is probably a terrible word to use to a software developer .

Speaker 1 48:59

Hey , clunky is a thing that we have to be very careful that we don't do , yeah yeah , that's right Now .

Speaker 2 49:04

How intuitive is it Like let's use the catch word how intuitive is it to actually start using , to look at and start to gain momentum with it ?

Speaker 1 49:14

Yeah , I personally think it's very easy and I've already made some adjustments over the last couple of weeks since it's been released , at least the time of this recording . That's something that I'm extremely that's extremely important to me is that it's very easy to use , that it is visually appealing and not cluttered , and so it's a very clean , streamlined interface as I'm describing it here . On the bottom on the home page , you have a home button . On the bottom you have a village button . You have a move , a nourish , a reflect and explore . So all you have to do is just tap on those things . Move , obviously , that's for movement , nourish it , that's food related stuff , that is , the other kinds of journals where you're just going to be reflecting . And then the village one is another cool feature that I'll tell you a little bit more about that after I answer this question .

Speaker 1 50:04

But yeah , so a nice little menu that you can also pop up and jump around through it . It's pretty straightforward on everything , you just tap a thing if you're interested in it . What is this ? There's a very simple add button to add a journal entry and different pages that show the journals that you have enabled tells you how many entries you have total and how many you've entered this week . Nice little , quick way to view it . Yeah , it's just real simple , straightforward for that . Now , if you go into building your own workout programs , obviously there's a little more involved in that , so that might take a little more time , but the core features of the app are very simple to use and to work with and that's super important to me . As you pointed out to you , that's one of the nice things with the app is that , to be honest , this thing would have cost . Like if you were to say you know , I want to have somebody develop this app and you had them develop this for you , it would probably cost you $75,000 , $80,000 minimum plus .

Speaker 2 51:05

Yes , I agree , and that's US . You're talking US . Oh , I know , because you know I've been working with Arcus Scope around building the Arcus Shift app and I know that it's . You know , just come up with an app and say , oh , this is what I want it to do , and then you walk away with it and it costs you . You know , it costs you $100 and you've got an app . There's tens of thousands of dollars that go into developing these apps , so you want to get it right . So you're in a position where you're lucky because you can develop and play with software in the background and that gives you the heads up . That's like me coming at people from a shift work perspective , because I've done it already . I don't have to study it . I know what it's like . I do have an app and I was literally just looking at it as you were describing things . I was literally just going through it , then having a look at it as well On the Android and , yes , I'm an Android user , I was looking at it there .

Speaker 2 51:52

Folks , little listening to this I can assure you this is something that it's really exciting , and I mean really exciting because we need to get away from this is my personal opinion , but need to get away from this diet culture and this tracking and weighing foods . You are a shift worker and you don't have time to literally go shopping , decide what you want , go shopping , track , weigh , cook , package up into containers and do that . You don't have that time . Some people do , and those that are thriving can actually do that as well . But I've coached like hundreds of shift workers now , and I'm using this intuitive eating side and getting them accustomed to acknowledging , honoring their hunger signals , using the hunger and fullness scale which is in the app doing a non-tracking approach and that's difficult for some people too . Jeff , you step away from a non-tracking approach because it's the way they're conditioned to it . But when we get to the end of a journey or we've been together for some time , they literally feel like the pressure's lifted right off them , as in all the life pressures .

Speaker 2 52:58

Because I think in particular , females and I know you focus mainly on male coaches , but I do feel horrendously sorry for a lot of females because I think , ever since females were around about eight years old , when their hormones start jumping up and down , there's a certain way their body changes shape . They've got boys chasing after them . They have to look a certain way , they have to behave a certain way . The expectations that are put on them are absolutely enormous and it's very confusing . And diet culture today teaches them you've got to be thin , you've got to look good , you've got to have big boobs , you've got to have big lips , you've got to have great hips , you've got to , you know , you've got to have thigh gap , you've got to have this , you've got to look this way . And when you don't live up to that expectation , you feel awful . But who says that ? Like you know who says that in reality ? And I think something like going the direction that we're going in is absolutely the way to go .

Speaker 2 53:53

I fully , fully support the intuitive eating way for people . I get clients that get to the end of their journey . I'll

Intuitive Eating App for Coaches

Speaker 2 53:59

be totally transparent here . I get people that get to the end of their journey and go . But I haven't really lost any weight , but their whole mindset's completely changed . They don't care anymore . They say to me I haven't lost any weight , but it's that they've become so in tune with their body for eating .

Speaker 2 54:16

But you know as well as I do , jeff , and as long as it's not the intention of intuitive eating , it's a weight neutral approach , and what that means is you're not focusing on weight loss , you're focusing on getting everything else right around it , but the byproduct of that can actually be weight loss because you lose , you know , you regain touch with your hunger and satiety , so you're not just eating by a rope , and I think that's where the app is so exciting to anybody that's listening . Now I just want to ask you as well . Now you told me I can be as a coach . I can use this . So for any of the coaches that are actually listening , let's say I've got 10 clients and I want them to do an intuitive eating approach and I want their journal you know , see their journal entries or whatever they wish to share with me how would I use it actually as a coach ?

Speaker 1 55:04

Yeah , one of the things that I've , that I made the decision to do was that obviously it's not a completely free app , because it costs money monthly to support it , to run my servers , and because we're talking best in class back in support for this thing .

Speaker 1 55:20

Yeah , I've written software for that . Bariats using that Citibank big corporations are running on and it's important to me that that this is that same quality of software for for the app and but yeah , so I've made it . But for coaches , I've decided to give it to them free so that it's not yet one more thing that they have to pay for to help support their clients . So the coaches can use it completely free and they can connect with their clients and obviously the clients would then pay that monthly subscription for their use . But the coaches don't have to worry about adding another expense there and I think that that's really cool for them . But they also , if they're connecting with their clients , the app also allows them to use it personally , because I know a lot of coaches who are still working on their own intuitive eating journey and working through different struggles in different areas . I mean , I use the app myself every day , so coaches can can use it personal as well as professionally in that way , and so that's really cool .

Speaker 2 56:19

Is it free for a coach to use personally for themselves ?

Speaker 1 56:22

Yeah , yeah , the coaches can use it , use it for themselves personally , and then they can also then connect with any of their clients that they want to . So , yes , what it does in the app for the coaches , it lets them have a view as a user . So they just tap a menu option and now they look at it as if they're a user , they get all the features for the user . They tap it as a practitioner and they get the special practitioner features that are that are built into the app that the normal user would not see . One of the other features that I want to make sure I highlight to then this one . I literally was writing code as we were before , and I'm going to probably wrap up with a little bit afterward , even though it's a little late here , but I've added a new feature already called Villages .

Speaker 1 57:06

Basically it's a group interaction , so it's sort of with a Twitter threads kind of a feel , where you can post questions , people who are part of your village and then myself as the moderator , and hopefully , over time , add in additional coaches in there . But you can get 24 hours a day . You can post in there and ask questions and get a response , start a discussion about something and inside the app there and there's one just for men . That's my men's community that I've been running . It's going to transfer over here , but then another one that's open to everyone and hopefully at some point just depending on what the app does open up some more kind of niche types of groups for people that are working through specific things or different demographics and that kind of a thing .

Speaker 1 57:49

But part of that and this is another cool thing I mean keep in mind , like I said , 6.99 a month , also with those villages is there's a weekly Zoom calls for the group where you can interact , live with me for some support , some coaching , interact with other people . My men's group has really benefited from being able to interact with other guys who are on this journey . They're like oh wow , there's other guys who are taking this intuitive eating approach . Not everybody thinks that we got to do 75 hard or like bust our butt in the gym and that kind of a thing , but there's other like-minded people and so you can find that support through the app also , and so , yeah , it's just a tremendous value .

Speaker 2 58:30

I think Now you know what I'm going to ask here , don't you , jeff ? You know what my next question is let's have a 24-7 village as well . That's got the shift workers in it , because I'd be honored to jump in there and do a live and help people around the shift work side of things as well . So I think and don't get me wrong here , I know I'm being forward here , but I honestly believe that if we could have a 24-7 village running as well and , I think , to help the shift workers around that as well , worldwide , I think that's something that would be truly special and I'd be very humbled and honored to actually and more than grateful to jump in and help with lives there , to help , because I'm on the same page and I can help people around all of that .

Speaker 2 59:10

Jeff , this is amazing . I'm just humbled that I know you and you're going through this , I've watched you do this and that I've embraced this side . And now that you're releasing this app to help people with this and you've had a chance to talk about what are the features that you've got in there today , but I can't begin to imagine where this will be in 12 months time , as it evolves and as it develops Now you've mentioned it a few times 699 , which is obviously US . For people , which I can tell you now to the Australians that are listening at the moment , I think that works out at around about $10 a month .

Speaker 1 59:41

Is that right ? Yeah , it's something like that . The app stores are set up where I just put in the US amount and I let them calculate the rest . But it's somewhere around there .

Speaker 2 59:51

I'll have to have a look in the store in the show notes , jeff . I'll be linking to it in both the Apple Store . I'll also link to it in the Play Store as well for our Android users to get in there and jump in and have a look at it . Have a plate juice , people , for $2.50 a week , and I know we don't want any more . But I can't begin to tell

Introducing the Non Diet Companion

Speaker 2 1:00:10

you that . You know .

Speaker 2 1:00:11

I know that Jake Lennard and Dr Jake Lennard is going down the line of their app base because we can't reach everybody and Dr Jake Lennard , who's the you know , the eating disorder researcher as well , they're going very app based now because people need this . Everyone's got their phone in their hand . They're using them . You can use them productively and I think something like this app .

Speaker 2 1:00:33

If you deleted your my Fitness Palin , you started using this . I can guarantee to you your life will be so much better in 12 months time Just 12 months . And also , I want to be clear and I think you were very clear when you first started this as well , jeff is it's one thing to have a generic app that you can write things in , but I still think it's extremely important to have a coach to hold your hand and actually guide you in these areas as well , which is bespoke , because the problems that Jeff has may not be the same problems that Roger Sutherland has , and I might be strong in one area and weak in another , and that's where a coach identifies those and helps you , leads you into strategies around how we can best problem solve that , and I think that's something that's really , really important .

Speaker 1 1:01:20

Oh yeah , and that's what you know when you think about the like , some of the features in the app . It's really cool to help you reflect and begin to be mindful of things Like on the Explore page there's a number of like forms where you can go through and fill out your childhood , any childhood food rules that you experienced in your family . So it goes through and you ask those things . Now a coach like you or myself would take that after a client filled that out and we would go through that with them and we would dive deeper into it based on the answers that they provided . Obviously , you're not going to get that , because the outfit is not a human being , but just going through that process of writing it down , it's amazing what a person who is being thoughtful and stuff can come up with on their own .

Speaker 1 1:02:05

So , while you may not get again , it's a 699 app that has journaling and stuff like that versus several hundred dollars a month to work with a coach . It's very different . And so if you have the means , obviously the two together would be phenomenal , but if you don't have the means , you're not left out , so you're still able to get some of those benefits . That's one of the things that's frustrating for a lot of people with intuitive eating is that there is a lot of privilege that goes with it the ability to eat in a way that is satisfying to you , to eat enough to be able to work with a coach who can help you work through these things and talk through them . But this is another way where we can kind of help some of those other people who may not have those means available or just can't find a coach in their area . That's the other thing , too is you don't know how to find a coach , so that can be really helpful in that regard too .

Speaker 2 1:02:56

Totally agree . It's some way to start and you can start to lay pillars and then you can use a coach later on if you need questions answered from those coaches and I think that's fantastic People that are listening to this now . I just want you to think about this over time , as we think about it Now , this is all very new for you and I totally understand that , but what I want you to have a think about now is over your journey , over your life , you've lost weight , you've regained it . You've lost weight , you've regained it . You've lost weight , you've regained it .

Speaker 2 1:03:26

Yo-yo dieting is detrimental to your health in a big way , right ? So I want you to think about it . If there's one more diet what Jenny at the office is doing , or Karen you know your neighbor or your best friend is doing doesn't mean it's going to work for you and are you going to be able to maintain it . You keep doing this calorie tracking and losing weight , going to F45 , doing your challenge losing weight but it's not working . So why not try something completely different which is supported by evidence that actually you can do , which is this intuitive eating , but go through the framework properly and learn and start to ingrain these habits and these thinking , this mindfulness , this journaling , this thinking in your mind , to make a massive , big difference to you down the track in the future . Because what you've done before it hasn't worked . And the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result , and we just don't want to do that .

Speaker 2 1:04:25

Try it , go down this line , get into the show notes , get it for your platform , give it a go . It's going to cost you people in Australia . It's going to cost you $10 . Well , maybe even $11 for a whole month , and that is not going to kill you for the changes that it will actually make to your life . Jeff , wow , we thank you so much .

Speaker 2 1:04:46

I'm so excited about this and I can't wait , and I'm actually my mind's already ticking over a million miles an hour here with things from the time that I found out about this , which was only like a week or two ago , when I actually saw the announcement and I thought , wow , geez , I've got to get Jeff on and have a chat . And you've come on and you've sold it beautifully , I think , and I think I've probably given you a fair nudge to , but anyway , but I always support and you know that I'll always support you with what you're doing , because I know you're coming from . You're not selling a supplement that doesn't work and telling there's evidence behind it . You're actually literally have created an app here , a tool that people can use that's going to make a massive difference to their lives .

Speaker 1 1:05:25

Thank you so much , jeff Well thank you , I really appreciate you bringing me on , and you know one that could go on forever talking about it . But one last thing that I'll mention , too , is that , if you're brand new to Intuitive Eating , too , I decided to go ahead and include my 12 week or 12 session video Intuitive Eating course in the app as well , at no additional cost . It's all part of the app now . So not only can you log your journey , but you also have that instruction there to get you started , to help you start to understand those principles and put them into into practice as well .

Speaker 2 1:05:59

So that's incredible . What value for 10 or 11 Australian dollars and 699 US . Jeff , thank you so much for your time . I do sincerely appreciate it . Thank you so much . It's great talking to you . And there you have it . That's Jeff Ash . How exciting . Now I've got to tell you .

Speaker 2 1:06:14

I know we've talked about this all the way through that podcast , but one of the most important things here is is the evidence doesn't support tracking as a weight loss strategy long term , and people have tried it , but they keep coming back and keep coming back and keep coming back . So we need something new and I honestly believe in fact , I got excited when I saw what Jeff was up to in releasing the non diet companion . I think this is going to be an exceptional app for people to use that are looking for that new thing , because , let's be honest , we're all looking around the internet these days and everyone's trying to find the thing , and I believe I honestly and sincerely believe that this is it . It's evidence based and Jeff is . If you just saw his contributions into some of our forums , he is incredible with the information and evidence that he provides around in his field and it's important that we understand that our regular styles of dieting and things like that these days , while they work in the interim , they don't work long term and that's why Jeff has developed the non diet companion , which follows all the principles of intuitive eating and let me tell you , it looks fantastic . I highly recommend that you download this app and have a have a go with it for a while . Even if you have a go for just a few months , just to see how it works for you , it may very well just change the way you look at the dieting and I use the quote end quote fingers dieting forever .

Speaker 2 1:07:50

If you got any anything out of that episode , I please asked if you would is to go ahead and rate and review the podcast on Apple and if you're listening on Spotify , rate it , and I would be totally indebted to you . This really , really does help the podcast immensely in for people to try and find it , and if you write a review , just like you came across this , other people will come across it , read the reviews and decide whether it's the podcast for them . I will catch you on the next one . Thank you for listening . If you enjoyed this episode , be sure to subscribe so you get notified whenever a new episode is released . It would also be ever so helpful if you could leave a rating and review on the app you're currently listening on . If you want to know more about me or work with me , you can go to a healthy shiftcom . I'll catch you on the next one .